Questions from a saltwater person.

[sullen]

Hi, I don't know very much about freshwater fish but I want to try discus.

First of all, I am not a fan of barebottom tanks, would it be possible to start a tank with a small layer of sand?

Are discus sensitive to nitrate?

How much gph flow do they like?

My ph is kind of high even out of my ro unit (7.5ish) can and should I decrease it with a product, will the ph be stable using something like that? I am not trying to breed them, should I even bother lowering it?

Is sump, wet/dry filtration okay?

What type of decor do they like?

Are there any good sites w/ exstensive information, don't seem to find much with web results...

Thanx ???

[korbi_doc]

:bounce2: :bounce2: :bounce2: Hi Sullen, welcome to Simply!!! If you can be successful with SW, then FW will work if you just seek out the info & this site is full of info 'bout the care & maintenance of discus! You need to read thru the immense am't of information & it'll seem mind boggling at first, but then settles in!
The substrate question is a book! Controversy prevails! Yes you can use thin layer of sand. The experienced ppl will tell you that if you start with juvies, they need bb cuz you need to feed heavily to get good growth. If you use much substrate or plants, start with adults!! I have one tank with a THIN layer of pebbles so when I clean the bottom the plastic cone picks them up & swirls them round, taking out the debris. Cleanliness is the most important part of discus keeping.. Lots of water changes, w/c, w/c, w/c VIP..
Yes, discus seem very sensitive to nitrates, so w/c, w/c.
The flow is another controversy! I use lotsa sponge filters & airstones, & my fish like to play in the current, others will tell you they don't like current, I don't find that so.
Your ph is fine!! DO NOT PLAY WITH IT, consistency & stability are what's important!!!!
Decor, driftwood, with or without plants on it; rocks with plants on them are ok; many of us use potted plants. I have a 125g with one small rock, large driftwood piece (vertical),
& 4 large potted amazon swords, 2 sponge filters & a lifeguard system (micron filter in module).
My 90g has the wet/dry. I like it, & will use a wet/dry if I set up another lg tank.

Keep reading & there are many threads in here that will answer all your questions, you only have to search. Also there are very many more experienced ppl here than I, who can help you with all your problems. Just remember you have to get all sides of the question, then do what works for you!! HTH, Dottie ;D ;D ;D DID I MENTION W/Cs??

[Carol_Roberts]

LOL, Dottie . . . Good advice :thumbsup:

[sullen]

Are bio balls and bio wheels OKAY? I know they can be nitrate factories and I hear these fish are VERY sensitive....

[korbi_doc]

:bounce2: :bounce2: Yes, I've heard that too from SW ppl. However, in my wet/dry tank my nitrates run 'bout 5 which is ok. Nitrites & ammonia must be 0. If worried & need to keep the nitrates down, many discus keepers use the common philodendron plant & just put the roots in the tank water & let the leaves fall down the sides or back of the tank for decoration! & I suppose you could put them in the sump of the w/d but you'd have to add a light for them! Potted plants & plants on driftwood in the tank help also! Refugiums might be a good additive to a discus tank, been thinking 'bout that but haven't enuff info yet to try it. lol, Dottie ;D

[Willie]

Sullen (great name!);

There is a major philosophical difference between raising SW fish and discus. SW systems are well balanced and the operating philosophy is restraint. Don't over feed, don't overcrowd.... Raising discus is just the opposite. Its hard to get high quality adults without pumping the young ones full of food. So you have to keep them scrupulously clean by making constant water changes -- the more the better. If you do that, then everything else -- pH, hardness, nitrate, ammonia, etc. -- will take care of themselves.

Welcome to the madness, Willie :D

[Mike_T]

I suggest you read through these (http://forum.simplydiscus.com//index.php?board=21;action=display;threadid=9911) and make a collective decision. Short cuts ALWAYS result in a bad time. We've all been there, done that. 8)

-mike

[DiscusRob]

:bounce2: :bounce2: Yes, I've heard that too from SW ppl. However, in my wet/dry tank my nitrates run 'bout 5 which is ok. Nitrites & ammonia must be 0. If worried & need to keep the nitrates down, many discus keepers use the common philodendron plant & just put the roots in the tank water & let the leaves fall down the sides or back of the tank for decoration! & I suppose you could put them in the sump of the w/d but you'd have to add a light for them! Potted plants & plants on driftwood in the tank help also! Refugiums might be a good additive to a discus tank, been thinking 'bout that but haven't enuff info yet to try it. lol, Dottie ;D

Hi Dottie, I know this is an old thread, but I wanted to ask if you ever tried a Refugium on a discus tank, I know they are used quite a bit on reef tanks, I am in the process of preparing to switch my 75 lake victoria tank over to a discus tank and have been planning on adding a fuge to it and running the lights over the fuge opposite the main tank light cycle, I know this stabilizes the pH in saltwater, and was wondering if it would do the same for discus. Thoughts please.

[rickztahone]

Hi Dottie, I know this is an old thread,but I wanted to ask if you ever tried a Refugium on a discus tank, I know they are used quite a bit on reef tanks, I am in the process of preparing to switch my 75 lake victoria tank over to a discus tank and have been planning on adding a fuge to it and running the lights over the fuge opposite the main tank light cycle, I know this stabilizes the pH in saltwater, and was wondering if it would do the same for discus. Thoughts please.

That is a huge understatement :D. I'm glad people are using the search function however. From my experience, freshwater setups tent not to use a fuge as much as SW tanks. Personally, I feel like the added sand can only allow stuff to grow on it that may not be wanted in the tank because it can potentially added nitrates. With that being said, I have seen a few FW setups that did have this in place.

[DiscusRob]

I wasn't really planning on the sand side of it, I was thinking more along the lines of some potted low light plants or floating plants, to help in nitrate control as well as the other benefits afforded by a fuge.

[rickztahone]

that may be a great idea. I know many stand by their pothos and their nitrate removal. I have personally not used pothos but would in the future if I could find the space.

[DiscusRob]

Had to look up pothos, now I know:). I think that with the proper set up, a fuge will/can go a long way towards a healthy tank. As I mentioned in my beginner thread, I'm in no hurry, so I have lots of time to plan and think this out properly. Might start a new thread if I go with this as set up(4' footprint) with most people might be the biggest issue as the available space under the tank is limited.

[rickztahone]

Had to look up pothos, now I know:). I think that with the proper set up, a fuge will/can go a long way towards a healthy tank. As I mentioned in my beginner thread, I'm in no hurry, so I have lots of time to plan and think this out properly. Might start a new thread if I go with this as set up(4' footprint) with most people might be the biggest issue as the available space under the tank is limited.

very true. I'm currently working on a 40g sump for my 75g tank as well. Looking forward to your findings.

[DISCUS STU]

I use potted ceramic or clay pots. As with everything you have to make sure a glaze won't pollute the water. I use river sand as the base and usually add some type of Amazon Sword like a Radican Sword which grow very tall and majestic.

Wet/dry filters (sumps?) have been used extensively throughout the years though a protein skimmer isn't necessary.

Don't worry about the ph, it's fine. Higher is actually better even though Discus come from low ph, low mineral waters. Higher will help insure minimal ph crashes.

Good luck! I know sw keepers that tried Discus but gave up and went back to salt. It's not as difficult as they or some people can make it out to be if you follow the right suggestions. Plenty of good advice here and in the various threads. I'd stay away from live foods like tubifex worms.

[DiscusRob]

I use potted ceramic or clay pots. As with everything you have to make sure a glaze won't pollute the water. I use river sand as the base and usually add some type of Amazon Sword like a Radican Sword which grow very tall and majestic.

Wet/dry filters (sumps?) have been used extensively throughout the years though a protein skimmer isn't necessary.

Don't worry about the ph, it's fine. Higher is actually better even though Discus come from low ph, low mineral waters. Higher will help insure minimal ph crashes.

Good luck! I know sw keepers that tried Discus but gave up and went back to salt. It's not as difficult as they or some people can make it out to be if you follow the right suggestions. Plenty of good advice here and in the various threads. I'd stay away from live foods like tubifex worms.

Thanks Stu,

Already knew about the protein skimmers, I was using my Reef Tank background as a base of knowledge, there is not a whole lot of difference between the 2 tanks, Discus vs. Reef Tank. Both require damn near perfect water and a boat load of patience to get the desired results. Never seen a bought reef tank, nor have I ever seen a bought Discus tank, both require love, dedication and most importantly Education.

[DISCUS STU]

Thanks Stu,

Already knew about the protein skimmers, I was using my Reef Tank background as a base of knowledge, there is not a whole lot of difference between the 2 tanks, Discus vs. Reef Tank. Both require damn near perfect water and a boat load of patience to get the desired results. Never seen a bought reef tank, nor have I ever seen a bought Discus tank, both require love, dedication and most importantly Education.

With that in mind I think you're well are your way.

[DiscusRob]

Thank You Sir