gasp! 1 discus dead, Are the others on death row?

[Simple2]

I won't go into the details on how I got myself into my current mess, why waste time.

I thought my tank and I were ready to enter the world of discus. WRONG!! Now I am paddling as fast as I can up stream to keep my discus alive.

I got 6 new discus on Oct. 25th from a nearby breeder recommended to me by a simplydiscus member. I feel that any deaths are my fault.

Tank and fish break down;
Discus only tank
2-4" discus
2-2 1/2" discus (had 3, before the 1 that died)
1-1 1/2" discus
55 gallon (tall)
bare bottom (painted)
1 big piece of malaysian (sp?) driftwood
1 big plastic plant
2 bio wheel 330 filter systems (just foam inside, no carbon used)
1 big fluval sponge filter (don't remember the exact size)
2 200 heaters

temp approx 84 degrees

food: tetra flakes, color bits, frozen bloodworm, Jack W. frozen discus food. (I feed whatever I feel like picking out of the above food types, 3 times a day, never the same type more then once a day.

I have done 4 water changes/vaccuming since I got the fish of approx. 18 gallons each time.(water used for change,airated for at least 24 hrs, chlorine and chlorimines removed by kent product, 84 degree temp)

water additives: stress zyme, Kent black water expert, Kent discus essentials.

All of the fish I started with but 2 appear to be eating just fine. 1 being the one that died. The other being the smallest 1 1/2" fish which is still alive..argh! for now.

I saw no visable signs of any problem with the one that died other then not eating (it died yesterday). The smallest one (the other one not eating) had a white string of waste coming from it yesterday. gasp! (parasites?)

I had an amonnia spike about 3 days after I got them .Obviously the tank is not completely cycled as I originally thought it was.

The only two thing I haven't mentioned...because I am a little embarrased. I have no idea what my PH is. I was going with the thought that if I had no intention of messing with the PH levels fearing I would just screw them up if I did, why bother to check it. It in the past has always run about 7.5. Last but not least, I know my water is moderatly hard, but I don't know exactly how hard it is.

Now what do I need to stop doing or start doing, buy, trash, or whatever it takes to try to save the rest? Are they doomed?

And Yes.....they do sell fish to people like me. Poor fish.
Dang, I have already become attached to them too.

Jackie
:'(

[Carol_Roberts]

Hi Jackie - take a deep breath - we'll get you through this.
Don't worry about the 7.5 pH (mine is higher)
Skip both the Kent products.

Do buy a pH test kit to make sure your change water is similiar pH to the tank water.

Do test for ammonia two or better yet three times per day. If any ammonia is present do a water change. If your filter is not cycled water changes are the best way to handle ammonia and nitrIte.

Your fish died fairly quickly . . . usually viral or bacterial illness will hit all the discus, so maybe this will be your only loss.

The smallest discus is showing symptoms of intestinal flagellates. This could be from stress due to the large difference in size. If the other fish are fine I would ot treat with metro or raise heat yet. If the rest are still healthy in a few days I'd rais the heat to 90 to see if that gets the little guy eating. (If there is a bacterial problem in the fish or tank high heat will make it worse.)

[ronrca]

Hang in there Jackie! ;)

Also treat with Prime or other conditioner that detoxes ammonia/nitrite! That will really help plus lots of water changes!

Welcome to Simplydiscus!
Your doing the right thing Jackie! Your doing good! Dont panic! ;) We are here to help!

[keith_cny]

Jackie,

If you can, get a Ph meter from Randal. I recently purchased a Hanna Pronto (Ph only) meter and it is great. I was having some Ph fluctuation in my well water and now can monitor it very closely and very accurately (which the discus like). The Pronto was around 75$ including shipping and calibration solutions.

Also if you can add a cycled sponge filter from another tank, do it ASAP. Get the ammonia to 0, keep the Ph fluctuations minimal and listen to Carol and Ronca!!

Good luck.

Keith

[Keith.L]

Jackie,

Not sure if this will help at all, but I noticed you had an amonnia spike and you mentioned about "stress zyme".

My small tank also came with a Bio Wheel and a small bottle of stress zyme. I was told the stress zyme was to help establish bacterial built-up on the BioWheel from fishless cycle. I was moving fish from an even smaller tank to this 22G and I never used stress zyme.

If by any chance stress zyme has been added after each water change, try not using it to see if it helps. For that matter I agree with Carol that it might also be worthwhile to stop using the other additives for the time being (Kent black water expert, Kent discus essentials).

In terms of feed, personally I'd stop using Jack W. frozen discus food for the next while until situation with your tank has stablized. I find the JW frozen food tend to cloud the water. The others are much better in not polluting the water (tetra flakes, color bits, frozen bloodworm).

Best of luck with your new setup.
-Keith 031104

[Simple2]

Thanks for all the info. I am breathing again.

I have been using an ammonia/detox since my ammonia spike.

I had exchanged 2 of the bio wheels from an established tank with the new one a few weeks prior to getting my fish. I also had put some gravel from an established tank in strainers in the new tank for a few weeks prior to the new fish to hurry the cycling process. I removed the gravel a day before I got the new fish. The big sponge filter I have has also been in the tank for several weeks along with all of this.

I have no problem with stopping the use of stress zyme, I really have never believed it actually works

I will hold off on the JW food for a while since they also love the bloodworm. I just hate to take away too many choices in fear that it may be one that the littlest fish (the problem eater) might be tempted to eat.

I have yet to see it eat, but the good news is I haven't seen any more white stringy waste. Of course if he's not eatting how much waste would he produce.

I have been searching all over town for an electronic PH monitor. No one carries one. I hate all the other methods of testing. I would love to buy one from Randal. I remember reading his post offering to sell them to members. I just can't find it again to get the info I need to order one from him.


I waited to reply until now so I could test my water with those stupid test strips that I feel are pretty much worthless. The water in the tank is about 7.0. The water being added is about 7.6, after airating and sitting for over 24 hours. My ammonia tests in what they call a safe mode but I do know that no amount of ammonia is not safe for Discus.

I remember when I was cycling my other tanks, I had trouble keeping the PH up during the process. I did use a buffer product that helped keep the PH stable during this period and it worked at keeping my Goroumi's alive and my PH stable.

Since most people advise not using anything but water changes to fix most problems. I am guessing that smaller more frequent water changes would be my best solution until everything settles down.

If this is wrong or any other suggestions please let me know? I am certainly not a chemist.

It sure is nice to have a place to go when in crisis.

I thank you and my fish thank you too.

Jackie :-*

[Carol_Roberts]

As long as the change water pH is a bit higher than the tank water you can do 50% water changes if you want to

[Miles]

Do 75% or more. Be safe and have HAPPY fish.

8)

[TUBBAZ]

hey i read somwhere that when discus feels unsafe, is new or stressed than they usually lay on their sides.
sometimes my discus do this while i am cleaning because they feel threatend.
thats all i can say


GET WELL SOON DISCUS!!!!!

[iceman_373]

Im not certain I would be adding any chemicals if you are changing 50% water everyday......it is a waste of your money.......just my lil 2 cents:)