UK NEWBIE NEEDS HELP

[karl470]

I HAVE A PAIR OF DISCUS AND WAS LONGING FOR THEM TO PAIR UP AND WITHOUT REALLY TRYING THEY HAVE,ABOUT 2 HOURS AGO THE FEMALE HAS STARTED LAYING EGGS(YIPPEEE).THE ONLY THING IM WORRIED ABOUT IS THE MALE DISCUS,IT IS HIS FIRST TIME(FEMALE HAS SPAWNED B4,BUT WITH OTHER DISCUS AT A FRIENDS SET UP).HE SEEMS TO BE EATING THE EGGS AS SOON AS THERE OUT.IS THIS NORMAL BEHAVIOUR FOR A FIRST TIMER?.IS THERE ANYTHING I NEED TO DO OTHER THAN WAIT AND SEE WHAT HAPPENS.CHEERS ::)

[Carol_Roberts]

Yep, that is pretty normal for a first timer. He may still be too young. Some take more than 20 times to actually fertilize the eggs and raise the brood.

[karl470]

THANX CAROL,YOUR PROBABLY RIGHT,I THINK HE IS A BIT YOUNG,IVE HEARD THAT BEFORE BUT HAD TO GET A SECOND OPINION.BUT AT LEAST I KNOW I HAVE A CHANCE IN FUTURE. ;D

[doron]

he
i have the same problem in my com' tenk
it's hapend about 10-12 time's
do u think that if i remove them to a b/t by
thier one it whould stop hepend ? or should i consetret in
other pair ?
( i have only 1 b/t for now )

doron

[hexed]

Mine too has a craving for caviar ???

[Carol_Roberts]

IF they are alone in their own breeding tank you don't have to worry about the other fish eating the eggs.

IMHO egg eating is a learned habit and usually taught by other discus in a community tank. The sooner you place them on their own tank. the sooner they will spawn successfully. Discus don't need bonding like human does. Breeders very often use the same male for several females.
Jimmy.

[discus_nw]

Perhaps in some cases it may be a learned behavior, and I am not disagreeing with that point. I also am of the thought that discus do not need bonding nor do they need to be allowed to spawn in a community tank to learn how "to get it right". It's all inherent.

Several reasons for this egg eating habit that developes may be 1) In most cases the male is immature. Alot of times 6 discus are bought and allowed to pair off. Usually, all six came from the same spawn so all are the same age. It's been my experience and that of many other people who have shared their experiences that the males usually start to perform well about 6 months after the females. 2) Many times when a pair start to spawn they are still young and the hormones in their bodies haven't regulated themselves and settled into a cycle (much like human teenagers). They will spawn and the urge to spawn may be there the next day. The eggs are eatened and another spawn occurs.

Jimmy,

didn't you once mention here that you felt egg eaters may be suffering from internal parasites? Someone did. If it was you, do you still hold to that therory?

I am sure there is not one single answer to why this happens. These are several, however. :)

[doron]

at my tenk the f laing the eggs & the m go after but with is mouth (he eat them ) so they dont have mach of a chens .....

i probebly remove them to a b\t hopepoly they lern how to do it ...

[alex_m]

Hi,

IMO egg eating is not a learned behaviour.

I think that parents eat the eggs for various reasons-water quality problems, parasites, environment and so forth.

Some fish never get it right, some get it right from the start.

I've had fish spawn and raise the babies right after i moved them into a new tank.

By the same token, i've had fish take months before they raised a spawn.

I've had males that did not fertilize well, it took them few times to get a nice hatch rate.

Ive had one parent raising the spawn, the other just sitting there and watching because of failure to produce enough slime. Babise will go to eat from the skin and when they find that there is no mucous they would hurry back to the other parent.

So, in IMHO it really depends on the fish.

alex

Discus_nw: You're absolutely correct in your experience. there're many factors which contributing to egg eating. I still stand on my findings on parasite, gill worms and hungry internal worms which bothering the experienced breeder who had successful spawns and start eating eggs. Usually a dose of formalin and sometimes deworming will solve the problems.
Last 2 years I did some experiment with 20 young pairs from the same brood. Starting at 8 months old when they began to pair up.

A control group of 5 pairs in a community tank which allowed to spawn at will and eggs were eaten by on-lookers. I don't want to go in detail which will be a several pages. They all became poor parents and egg eaters. Some even got so bad that they snack on their own eggs in the middle of spawning and then continue after a meal of caviar. After 6 months of continuous trying.They eventually sold to a Japan public aquarium for the show tank. I didn't have the patience to correct them.

Pairs which were separated and allowed their first spawn in a breeding tank did not usually know eggs can be eaten and guarded them until they were all fugus and rotten. Attack anything come near them. Some pairs did eat eggs at the first spawn and will usually stop if the infertile male was replaced by a proven male. Some as young as 9 months old had successful but limited number of wrigglers at the first spawn.

Most females had successful first spawn with an experienced fertile male at 9 month of age.

If they were put back in the community tanks and allow to eat eggs from other fish. All became egg eaters but, a big BUT. They can correct themselves after a few more spawns and rememeber how to care for the eggs and became good parents once again.

I will futher discuss this finding if someone is interested.
Jimmy.

[doron]

he jimmy
it's verry intr' .
if i undersend u so i better take my youngest pair from the com' tenk & take them to a b/t
doron

[alex_m]

5 pairs were allowed to form in a 270 gal tank.

They all paired up naturally.

Everytime they spawned the other fish ate the eggs.

They were allowed to spawn three/four times in this fashion.

Then the pairs were moved to their own breeding tanks.

Three raised the babies right from the start, the other two raised the babies four months later.

Then one of the pairs that got it right from the start was moved back to a 135 gal. community tank with 8 other adult discus.

They spawned again and the eggs were gone the next morning. This continues for a period of two months.

Then they were placed back into their breeding tank and raised the babies from the next spawn.

alex