Metro as a preventative?

[tag]

Is it ok to dose the fish with Hexamit as a matter of routine? I know that medicating the fish without an obvious reason is not a good plan but I've been suspecting either hex or flukes and wondered if I could medicate the tank...all the discus without harming any of them if in deed it wasn't necessary.

Sorry...I'm a real newbie to this routine care and medication stuff. Need a hand :)

Thanks

Tina

[M0oN]

I wouldn't recommend it except for proactive treatment of newly aquired fish.

It's not cheap, either...you have to dose about double what each hexamit capsule is because of tolerance to the medication these days...

Just don't feed live foods and you don't have to worry about hex :)

[jules]

Metro is an antibiotic and shouldn't be used unless necessary IMO.
I don't feed live foods and unfortunately I have a "patient" in treatment right now for Hex.

Check out this link:
http://forum.simplydiscus.com//index.php?board=10;action=display;threadid=1058

[fcdiscus]

I have had fish that never touched live food in their lives, and they came down with hex. I believe -as do alot of others- that the hex lies fairly dormant, and it is brought on by stress.
I agree however, that Hexamit or metro should not be used inadvertently, but if you suspect a problwem- post it and someone will surely help you. Frank

[discus_nw]

I am not for prophylactically treating with any antibiotic, including metro. Many discus carry the bug in their gut, and are perfectly able to tolerate them in small numbers. When the discus has become compromised in any of a variety of circumstances, the flagellate multiplies unchallenged resulting in a diseased condition. Then, medication is required. In the meantime, treat them prophylactically with good care. :)

[Carol_Roberts]

The best preventative is large daily water changes, clean filters and a bare bottom tank.

[CARY_GLdiscus]

I only use it when needed!

Maybe every few months on a few discus that were stressed because of water quality or from being crowded.


MOon,
I would like to know were You came up with Your info? if it came from books they are wrong! if it came from a breeder he is also wrong! I happen to agree with mat and frank on this one. the problem is like this someones starts buying fish from someone else and sells them to others and at this time both are feeding live worms but stop because of hex problems. I would say check Your source first and not blame the worms
JME.

well to state the facts your more then likely not dealing with hexamita anyways but spironucleus or cryptobia. All three are related and all are internal protozoans which have never been found in live worm studies
at a pathology lab.

hth
Cary Gld!

[brewmaster15]

I agree with cary and the others here. One clarification though, Theres a big difference between treating prophylatically for Hex and treating regularly as was the question. treating with any med on a regular basis is not a great idea..Tthough most do it with flukes and worms. Treating new fish for the most common protozoan and worms is considered by many part of their normal routine for "conditioning" new stock.

IF I get new fish in and they are going to be in their own tank for any long period of time(months) Then I will not treat them with Metro ..unless I need to. IF they are going to go into my tanks with my other fish.. I ALWAYS give them a weeks metro dosing as part of my QT procedure before they enter my population of fish. The problem with waiting at that point is ...If you see white feces in the tank... you need to treat that whole population which adds cost to the fish, increases the use of the med in general and is a risk I won't take with my fish.

This is a principal that is used in all animal husbandry for parasites. It is even used in our public aquariums.

I recognize that by saying I use metro prophylactically on many new fish that I may be contributing to metros over use but I have to be honest ... I have never had to treat a discus for hex after the qt period was over by doing what I do, unless I skip that part of my regime...maybe its just coincidence. What I think is a worse problem than one treatment of new fish is the number of misdiagnosis and repeat treatments many use everytime they see white feces or the fish is dark or off the feed:)

Thats my story and I'm sticking to it!!!! :)

jmho,
al

[CARY_GLdiscus]

WELL SAID BREW,

Way to stick with the Topic!





BUT SOMEONE HAS TO SAVE THE WORMS LOL! LOL! LOL! ;D

[brewmaster15]

LMAO Cary! :) By the way..thanks for the honesty in how you use it! :) :)

-al

[CARY_GLdiscus]

THE WORMS OR THE METRO? hee.hee.hee...


THE WORMS I USE ALOT LOL!


THE METRO I GIVE MORE AWAY! LMAO!


However It should be added that You can get internal bacteria
problems in Your Discus from bad worms with the signs of sickness looking like spironucleus I mean HEX :P

hth
Cary Gld!

[jaydoc]

al,
I am a little confused about the white feces thing. If there is white feces in the tank on occaision only, but everybody looks great and eats great, do you treat the tank? Or do you just keep the tank conditions pristine and see if any body starts to look sick? Is Hex the only thing that gives white feces?
Cary, the lesser

[M0oN]

Cary, I should've been a little more specific.

I meant I would only recommend using metro on newly aquired fish that are suspected of having hex...

The only time I treat fish without knowing for sure if they have somthing or not is if I get a wild discus and that's for gill flukes and such...

[CARY_GLdiscus]

Mr MOon,

You should Have No worries YOU ARE DOING A FINE JOB!
Good luck with the new spawns.

Takecare
Cary + Family ;D

[jules]

What the Discus eat can affect the appearance of their feces.
When I feed white mosquito Larvae, I see white looking feces.
If the fish stops eating, hides in the back of the tank head down and has white feces- I assume hex. I don't have a microscope.
What is usually misdiagnosed as hex? Is there a way of confirming what it is without examining the flagellates under a microscope?
Makes a beginner like myself want to keep guppies ;)

[tag]

My 13 year old son is breeding guppies without any trouble :) but I'm not giving up....I've come waaaaay too far to stop trying to be successful now.

Thanks to everyone who's helped keep me going :).

Take care all

Tina

[brewmaster15]

Cary the lesser, :) :)jaydoc

white feces is usually caused by either a parasite ...can be worms, can be protozoans like hexamita and spironucleus, or it can be bacterial. If one fish has it, its probably worms or protozoan...If many of the fish are exhibiting it at the same time, its most likely bacterial. The bacterial condition is caused by bad foods. This complicates diagnosis because many of these bacterias are susceptible to metro...so people think they have hex... some of the bacterias are not too susceptible because metronoidazole only works on a few bacterias, in theses cases people may use more metro at higher doses because they conclude the hexamita is resistent to the meds...when in truth...The meds may not be the best for treating the bacteria....If its bacterial .... a med like kanacyn or erythromycin is better....If its hexamita...then metro... if worms then a dewormer...

How do you know which, unfortunately its a learning curve... and the best you can do is post when you have the problem and hopefully someone up on the curve can help :)

Tina and Jules... never give up....diseases are the exception , not the norm if you keep the fish happy with good food, clean water and stable conditions...when disease happens... and it does to everyone some time... ask for help if you need it and there are people here that can try to help.

-al

ps/...jaydoc, to answer your question... if theres white feces being shed into a tank...those feces are probably loaded with pathogens... Under that circumstance I would treat the whole tank, even healthy fish can only withstand high numbers of parasites for so long....though removing the fish is often alls thats needed., There is always a chance that you will just be treating the others a month or two down the road.

[discus_nw]

Topic: Metro as a preventative?

Sounds like treating prophylactically to me ??? ;D ;)