Water changes from tap

[brandy]

I've been keeping discus for about 3 months - so far everyone is healthy and happy. I have been doing water changes from the tap without any problems (usually 30-50% every other day depending on tank size). My water comes from the tap with a pH of 8.4, then drops to 7.8 if I age it. As I said, it doesn't bother my fish to use the 8.4 tap water, but is this harmful to them? When I did a water change last night the pH rose by .4 with a 40% water change. I've done emergency water changes of up to 75% with tap water as well, with no ill effects. What do you think? Do I need to start aging water or can I continue to use it straight from the tap?

[RyanH]

A drop in pH will cause stress on your fish. I would definately start to age it. The affects on your fish may not be apparent in the short run but can result in them becoming weaker and more disease prone in the long run. Remember, the pH scale is logarythmic like earthquake scales. That is, for every 1/10 of a point drop in pH, you have water that is many, many times more acidic.

hth!

[brandy]

My pH actually rises when I do water changes, then lowers very slowly over a period of about 48 hours. I would like to be able to age my water, but I'm not sure yet if I can find the space.

[Rick_May]

well, if it's not broken don't fix it.

[ronrca]

I agree with Steve! Over the long term, your discus will start to feel the effects of it and become sick. Sickness comes from various factors, one being stress. We to someone who is stressed, in dis-stress which is due to not being at ease or also called dis-ease. This leads to disease. Over time, it will wear on the discus like lack of sleep. Aging your water will only much things easier over the long run.

How big is the tank? Finding room to age 50% isnt as difficult as you may think. Many times directly under the tank is a good place for put a rubbermaid container. ;)

HTH

[brandy]

I currently have a 90 gallon, 55 gallon, 20 breeder, and soon another 55 gallon and a 40 gallon. I found a 200 gallon container for $109. I am going to get it and put it in my basement - if I can fit it through the doorway. How many watts will I need to heat this?

[Carol_Roberts]

A couple of 300 watt heaters - depends on how cold your basement is . . .

[brandy]

It may get down toward 60 in the winter. I will use styro insulation under the tank since it will be on concrete.

[ronrca]

Good idea on the styrofoam. I have a 250G huge barrel and I use 1 300W titantium heater with no problem. ;)

[engiskhan]

Brandy, if I were you, I'd just get a couple of rubbermaid garbage cans. I use one 33 gallon for my 55 gallon tank. Does Bismarck use chloramines like Grand Forks does? If they do, you may want to invest in an RO unit like I did. I know my discus are alot happier with reconstituted RO water than they are with aged tap water. Randalb on these forums has excellent deals on them.

[brandy]

There are no chloramines in Bismarck water, which is good. I decided to go with the 200 gallon container for a few reasons.

1. I don't have space for water storage beside or under most of my tanks - the only extra space is in my basement.

2. I plan to add more tanks and hopefully breed soon so I will need a fair amount of water storage.

3. In my situation I felt it was easier, and cheaper in the long run to go with one big holding container. For example, I only need a couple of larger heaters rather than several small ones. I also don't need to switch my pump to different containers when doing water changes on multiple tanks. I only need to refill and check water parameters on one tank rather than several.

4. When I had a holding container beside my saltwater tank people seemed to think I was crazy ???. My mom didn't understand why I would want to have a large garbage can in my living room. Although it didn't bother me at the time I finally realized that I didn't like the idea of a large garbage can in my living room either. After all, I could use that space for another tank instead ;D.

5. This one is probably most important. Since my water changing supplies are in my basement I can keep the area as messy as I want. If I'm in a hurry and leave hoses laying around it's no big deal.

So, now I have my 200 gallon container in my basement, awaiting the arrival of my heaters and my Mag 18 pump (hopefully will come on Monday). I'll let you know how things go.

[ronrca]

;) :thumbsup:
Good for you! I would love to see pics! ;) ;D

[jaydoc]

brandy,
I have a 175, a 75 and a 29 gallon aquarium on my first floor. I have a 300 gallon holding tank setup in the basement with a mag pump and heaters. You will also need some aeration in the holding tank-air stones or something. The mag pump is plumbed up throught the livingroom floor behind the aquarium. there is a hose spigot there that a python can hook to. I also plumbed a washing machine drain box into that wall. This allows me to drain my tank directly into the house plumbing. there is a hose bib there that has the hose to fill my storage barrels attached. This hose goes through the floor to the basement where it is attached to a float valve on the storage barrel. The power cord for the mag pump also comes up through the floor and plugs in behind the aquarium when in use. This setup allows me to perform water changes without even going to the basement!!!!
It works like this:
1) Drain 50% of tank volume into wall drain.
2) Run python from spigot from basement into tank.
3) Turn off fill hose to basement ( otherwise, when the water level drops in the vat, the float valve will start running cold tap water into the vat)
4) Plug in mag pump
5) Open spigot from basement and let 'er fill.

When tank is full, unplug pump, shut off spigot from basement, turn on fill faucet to basement and walk away! When the basement vat is full, the float valve shuts it off. If I do water changes on all three tanks, it can take 30-40 minutes to fill the basement vats again. Now I don't have to wait for that to finish before I can get on to something else.
Cary the lesser

[brandy]

Wow, that sounds like a great setup! I plan on moving within the next couple of years, so I don't want to get that involved yet. When I move I will definately consider a setup like that. Did you tap into your main water line to fill the holding container? What diameter hose/pipe are you using? I am currently filling my container with a hose hooked up to my bathroom faucet - it takes a really long time. I'm thinking about trying to use the water hookup for my washing machine but I don't know if that will speed things up enough. Any pointers you can give me would be appreciated :D.

[jaydoc]

I use a box in the wall like the one behind the washing machine. It has a hot and cold faucet and a drain. I had one plumbed right into the wall in my living room behind the aquarium. If I ever move someone will wonder why there is a laundry setup in the living room! It is still very slow. That is why I use the float valve, I can turn it on and forget it.

[Cosmo]

Brandy,

Go to Home Depot and pick up some 1.5 inch styro construction insulation, works great under the holding tank. Another issue on the heaters, is how cold your water is coming into the tank from the tap, or, from you're RO. If you run RO, run about 50 ft of line from the tap thru a warm water bath ( a rubbermaid container with a heater in it) - it'll increase your RO output, and, reduce the wattage required to keep your holding tank temp steady.

[brandy]

I put 1.5 inch regular styro (not insulation, just the white stuff) under the holding tank. I don't use RO, just straight from the tap. I'm not sure how cold the water is coming out of the tap, but I put as much warm water as I can into the tank. So far the heaters seem to be keeping up okay, but I've only filled the tank with about 150 gallons up to this point. I'm currently trying to figure out how much agitation I need to keep in the tank for proper off-gassing. Right now I have a 300 gph powerhead and a large airstone in the tank. I'm going to add at least one more airstone and I think that should do it. The pH is dropping to its stable point within 24 hours, and that's all I'm worried about (I still add prime, just to be on the safe side). Last night I used the aged water for the first time. It was nice to be able to do a big water change and not have to worry about temperature swings. I have a 90 gallon aquarium about 15 feet above the holding tank. The mag 18 pump filled the aquarium in about half the time it normally takes from the tap. So far, so good ;D

[brandy]

BTW, I wish I could just go to Home Depot to pick stuff up. The closest one is three hours away :'(. We have a store called Menards instead. It is like Home Depot with less selection, higher prices, and staff that possesses less useful knowledge than my dog. I try to go there as little as possible.