Any idea why..... ?

[nanik]

Hi,

I'm quite new in discus just started 1 month ago, I have 10 discus (5 MR and 5 LSS), their sizes varies from 2.5" to 3.5" and they are all healthy. My aquarium size is 1.5m x 40cm x 40cm and I fill with 30cm of water everytime and change 80-90% of the water everyday. The aquarium is on the floor on top of a styrofoam.


Few questions that I would like to ask,

1. Everytime I come home at night and check on them (around 7-8pm) I notice that all the MR are staying quite and 2-3 of them sometimes stays quietly horizontally while none of the LSS is doing this, and when morning comes they are all swimming around and all fins are up and ready to eat, why is this ?

2. It's been 1 month and I notice that they never want to come infront of the tank, if they see somebody is there all they do is just group together and stay in one corner. But, if there is nobody they start swimming around, is this normal ?

3. I feed them 3 times a day (7am, 12pm and 5pm) - Tetra Bits and Frozen Bloodworms, is this ok ? (No beefherat for them because of personal reason).

Thanks

[Condor]

The position of your tank may be part of your problem. The higher your tank is, the more secure your fish will feel. Another factor may be the color of the bottom of your tank. (I assume that you have a bare bottom tank) Darker colors will help your discus feel more secure. You might want to try painting the underside of the tank or the styrofoam. The foods that you are feeding are good nutritious foods, but you might want to vary the diet a little more. The more variety they have, the better they will grow. There are many non beefheart frozen foods out there. Ocean nutritions formula one is an example. This food is designed for marine fish, but works well for discus. Be sure to do good water changes with this food, however, because it will pollute your water if not eaten. You mentioned that some of your fish swam horizontal. Can you explain a little more on the behaviour of these fish? Hope all goes well with your discus.
Adrian

[nanik]

The position of your tank may be part of your problem. The higher your tank is, the more secure your fish will feel. Another factor may be the color of the bottom of your tank. (I assume that you have a bare bottom tank) Darker colors will help your discus feel more secure. You might want to try painting the underside of the tank or the styrofoam. The foods that you are feeding are good nutritious foods, but you might want to vary the diet a little more. The more variety they have, the better they will grow. There are many non beefheart frozen foods out there. Ocean nutritions formula one is an example. This food is designed for marine fish, but works well for discus. Be sure to do good water changes with this food, however, because it will pollute your water if not eaten. You mentioned that some of your fish swam horizontal. Can you explain a little more on the behaviour of these fish? Hope all goes well with your discus.
Adrian


Hi Adrian,

Thanks for your kind reply.

For the last 1 week I notice from morning until probably around 4-5pm the fish are swimming fine and well no problem at all, all of them are swimming and looking for food, and they all swam vertically. But after 6pm some of the MR looks like they are "sleeping" because they are not swimming but just stay put in one place and they are not "standing" vertical but horizontal, but not all of the MR are in horizontal 90 degree position sometimes around 50-75 degree position. I always thought that they might be sleeping. But when morning comes they are fine and swimming vertically (no signs of swimming horizontally), and they are looking around for food, and not hiding in one corner, only everytime they always swims in a group never leave one another.

Hope it gives you a bit of idea of my problem ??? ???

Thanks

[Condor]

This is not normal. If they are eating well though, that is a good sign. Sounds like maybe an internal adjustment problem. Make sure that you get an answer from a moderator who might have more expertise in this subject.

[Howie_W]

Hi nanik,

It sounds like your fish are not use to movement in front of the tank. Placing them closer to waist/eye height will help.


Howie

[Anonapersona]

I've got a few comments...

When the light is coming from the side of the tank fish will often swim off-level. I've observed my fish tilting toward the window. But most likely it is that they are asleep -- is the tank light off? My fish will start to rest in the late afternoon if the light is off and the room quiet even if the room is bright.

I also wonder if a fish that is so easily buffeted by high current might need to lay down to sleep, lest it end up crashing into something while asleep. Are the fish that are listing to the side in the higher current area? I recall seeing a post by someone who said his fish slept in a pile on the floor of the tank -- avoiding current is the only reasonable explaination I can think of for this.

As for the shyness, I bribe my fish to love me... I feed them New Life Spectrum which is tiny, tiny pellets as a treat when ever I want to. A tiny pinch gives everyone a bite or several and there will be no leftovers. It does not swell and is very, very good food. So, whenever they come to greet me I feed them. "What you reward you will get more of"

I disagree with the color of the botom of the tank as an issue. The on the floor location is probably more important. I think that the fish like to see your face, it is round, they are round, looks like a friend and gives food every time. Fast moving feet and shoes look like danger.

One last thing, it may be that your location is too quiet and protected. If things were normally busy and loud, they would be used to it, but if it is dim and quiet all the time then you come in this will be frightening.

[nanik]

Hi,

I'm attaching few pictures of my setup just to give a better understanding of my situation. Hope this will be easier for people to give me feedback as how to make my setup and my discus healthy and "kicking" ;D ;D ;D

Thanks

[nanik]

The following picture shows my aquarium and my water barrel that contains my aged water. The blue material I'm setting up to close the surrounding areas to minimize the amount of direct sunlight coming in.

[nanik]

The blue material I'm using, not sure what you guys called it in USA, but in my country it's called "Terpal" ;D ;D ;D

[nanik]

This is what I mean when I said that they are grouped together in a corner. Sorry for the "greenie" algae on the glass, it's not there anymore just wipe out everything clean today

[nanik]

Last picture of my setup.

[Howie_W]

Hi nanik,

You have some basic issues going on, primarily related to your water quality, and the amount of light coming into the tank.

You need proper filtration in your tank, and using a powerhead laying on the bottom is not the way to go...at the very least several sponge filters will do the trick for starters. Discus are able to deal with a strong current in the water, but with a powerhead placed on the bottom like that they're getting blasted by it. In that size tank you also need to have the water level filled to the top...without it that many fish do not have enough water.

Even if you recently wiped your glass, the amount of algae showing in your pics tells me the tank is not getting cleaned regularly.

It will also help if you get you the tank up off the floor, and attach a light colored background directly to the back of the tank...some people like to paint their tanks as well.

Have you been testing your water? What are you getting for ammonia and nitrate readings?

Howie

[nanik]

Hi Howie,



You need proper filtration in your tank, and using a powerhead laying on the bottom is not the way to go...at the very least several sponge filters will do the trick for starters. Discus are able to deal with a strong current in the water, but with a powerhead placed on the bottom like that they're getting blasted by it.


Actually I put the powerhead in the aquarium is not for filtration, I use it for draining the water from the aquarium during water change, as it is easier to do that. I'm thinking of getting some sponge filter, but since I change the water everyday is it still necessary for the sponge filter ?. At the moment I'm planning to setup a bigger water barrel so I can do 2 times a day water change.



In that size tank you also need to have the water level filled to the top...without it that many fish do not have enough water.


What you mean by "without it that many fish do not have enough water", I'm a bit lost here :)




Have you been testing your water? What are you getting for ammonia and nitrate readings?


No I haven't done any testing as yet, planning to buy some test kits for ammonia, nitrate and chlorine, just waiting for the paycheck on the 1st of next month ;D ;D :D :D :D ;) ;)

Thanks

[Howie_W]

Hi nanik,

One of the most basic practices of fish keeping is to set-up a cycled tank before placing your fish in. If you use the search function there are plenty of articles on this subject available on the forum. You can start here;

http://forum.simplydiscus.com//index.php?board=2;action=display;threadid=934

Daily water changes are not a replacement for the cyclying process. Part of this process also includes having a proportionate amount of clean water to coincide with the number and size of your fish.

Howie

[Carol_Roberts]

1. Everytime I come home at night and check on them (around 7-8pm) I notice that all the MR are staying quite and 2-3 of them sometimes stays quietly horizontally while none of the LSS is doing this, and when morning comes they are all swimming around and all fins are up and ready to eat, why is this ?

2. It's been 1 month and I notice that they never want to come infront of the tank, if they see somebody is there all they do is just group together and stay in one corner. But, if there is nobody they start swimming around, is this normal ?

3. I feed them 3 times a day (7am, 12pm and 5pm) - Tetra Bits and Frozen Bloodworms, is this ok ? (No beefherat for them because of personal reason).


1. If it is dark or near dark they are sleeping.

2. They are afraid and or stressed.

3. Food is fine.


Fish "exhale" ammonia all day and and all night. Ammonia builds up in the tank and poisons the fish. A cycled filter converts ammonia to nitrIte and then to nitrAte. NitrAte is not too toxic to discus and is easily removed with water changes.

Right before a water change your water may be full of ammonia. May be you should do two water changes per day - morning and evening until you can get a filter cycled.

Having the tank higher off the ground will make the fish feelmore secure.

[nanik]

Hi,

I have made a new table for my aquarium and thought I post it to let you guys know about it. Today is the first day and I'm seeing improvement where they are swimming around and not hiding in one corner, so let's see how it goes and keep you guys posted about it.

Thanks

[nanik]

Another picture

[Carol_Roberts]

They look happier ;D

[bio new]

Nanik,

IMHO, there is still room for you to top up the water level say 2 inches from the top of the tank. Discus will feel more comfortable in a deeper tank.

:-\

[Howie_W]

Hi Nanik,

You're fish look much happier. :)

A word of caution...make sure the table you are using is strong enough to support the weight of your tank.


Howie

[nanik]

Hi,

Yeah they look much happier, today is their 2n day and when I went up to check up on them they were swimming around and not crowding in one corner, it's a nice feeling to see them swimming happily. Today morning I feed them and it took time before they want to eat the pellets, but once they are eating there is no stoping them :D :D :D

Don't worry the table is very strong, the wood if I'm not mistaken is a Teak wood (not sure the English name for it), but in our country it's called JATI 8) 8) 8). This kind of wood is use in making furniture and most of the time the furniture is for export, so it's of very high quality and very very strong. I have tested for 2 people to jump on top of it and it's sturdy as a rock ;D ;D ;D ;D

[ping]

hi Nick,

I think they call it Jarrah wood. Nice place, lots of space, put more tanks inside ;D.
Your stand looks scary ;D.

Ronny :)