Filter advice

[sidra]

I have a 29 gal planted tank with an Eheim 2213 canister filter (for up to 66 gal tank). I'm basically happy with it but trying to make changes to improve it. It came with the ceramic "noodles" on the bottom, then a pad, then substrate, a fine pad and then a carbon pad. I think too much stuff was still getting through the filter. Plus the guy at my lfs said he doesn't like the noodles as waste gets caught in the hollow insides and creates harmful gases as it decays. He recommended Eheim's Grob. It's like easter basket grass only thicker and stronger. He said he's used it and it works great. I took out some of my noodles and put in some grob. I will make this change gradually so I keep up my bacteria colony. I also added a second fine pad at the top.

1. Is there any truth to this theory of noodles media not ideal because of gases produced?

2. What media combinations do you all use in your canisters?

3. I get a lot of build-up in my filter tubing. How often do you clean that? Is that "friendly" bacteria in there. I want to clean it but if they are good bacteria I don't want to wipe them out. However, chunks break free and come out my spray bar, break up and float around my tank before finding their way back into the filter.

3. Also, I am shopping for a 70 gal tank and am thinking of using a wet/dry on it. Is that a good idea?

Sorry if these are dumb questions, but I've always had small, non-discus tanks so have never had a canister filter.

[funkyfish]

if u put a prefilter sponge on the intake of the filter u should not have a prob with soild waste in the filter it will get traped in the prefilter and won't make it to the canister just clean it once an while . i use bioball in my canister have not use the noodles or the grob
good luck

[Cosmo]

Sidra,

It's all true and not true :D

The purpose of the ceramic tubes is to trap the larger pieces of debris that enter the filter before they get to the bio media, and, to redirect the water flow across the entire filter bed above. These are not intended to biological media although they will become so if left uncleaned. I always clean this part of the filter in chlorinated water each time I clean the cannister to prevent them from growing bacteria colonies.

By grob do you mean the ehfifix?? The green noodle things? I used this for the first time to replace the blue pad... maybe it's supposed to replace the ceramic's instead? lol This stuff though you throw away while the ceramics you can clean and reuse basically forever... much cheaper that way :)

No matter what you use, there will be nasty side effects if you don't clean the filter regularly.

I have several Classic Eheims, in all of them I use the ceramic rings as the lower layer, although I've removed many of them since I have pre-filters on the intakes and therefore less large debris entering. Next, the blue pad which again should be washed out in chloriated water with each filter cleaning. Then the sintered glass (ehfisubstrat) which is excellent bio media. This you rince GENTLY with either tank water or dechlorinated water so as not to kill off the bacteria (don't leave it sitting exposed to the air during filter cleaning either - I put mine in a tupperware bowl filled with tank water). Since I've removed some of the ceramic rings I add more bio media than what came with it. Next is the ehfisynth, or, in case you prefer to buy more of the cut to fit fine filter pads for the top. I use the ehfisynth and cut 2 to3 pieces to put on top of the biomedia. Very very little gets thru these. I don't use the carbon pads

Eheim I believe suggests changing the fine pads each month and a complete filter cleaning each 3 to 4 months... TOO LONG. Clean the entire filter every month at the very least - put prefilters on the intakes are rinsed with every WC. big difference.

The buildup in your hoses should be cleaned off periodically. It's essentially the same bio slime that builds up on the inside wall of your tank that you wipe off periodically (you do, don't you ?? :) )

Wet/Drys are great filters, the only reason I didn't put one on my big tank was Im not sure how they would hold up during 50% WC's.. thinking you'd have to turn off and restart... but... could be wrong about that so hopefully others will post if that's wrong....

I do have an eheim wet/dry on the big tank as well and am really happy with that. Uses a syphon tube instead of an overflow so I can do heavy water changes without losing the flow... if you go that route, get the smaller model for the 70 as they really pump heavy during the up cycle

Hope this helps :)

Jim

[sidra]

Thanks for the good info. I had been cleaning all of my filter media in tank water, but I will switch to cleaning the noodles and blue pad in chlorinated water. Also I've heard of and like the idea of using more than one bio pad on top and giving one a good rinse in chlorinated water and the other in tank water and as rotate them as you clean one in chlorinated water.

Yes, the grob is the ehfifix (german name grobfilterung, aka grob). It's green curvey strings of plastic. You can rinse and reuse it for a long time as well. The guy at the lfs (aka SALESMAN, I'm sure) said you need a flame-thrower to destroy it. Exaggerating, ya think?

I still need to get a pre-filter. LFS never has them in stock. Guess I'm gonna have to place an order.

My tank routine is this...

20-30% water change every day (ughhh) sometimes up to 40% if the fish don't look so happy or if I've used meds and am done treating.

Wipe down glass, filter intake & return and airline tubing (what's hanging inside tank) every 2 days/3 days at least.

Rinse filter media in tank water about every 3 weeks but I'll start checking that more often.

Two of my discus are babies and have been more susceptible to disease so I've been very good about my water changes. Didn't know how important that was until I found this forum.

When I get this 70 gal I'm sure I'll have a whole mess of new questions.

[Cosmo]

Hi Sidra,

Well, I learned something new today :) and grob is so much easier to say and write than ehfifix too ... lol

You kind of lost me on the "bio pads on top", maybe because I don't have 2213's only 2215 and 2217's and had assumed they were the same. The top pad at least on these is used strictly for preventing any fine debris from entering back into the tank, not for bio. When you clean the filter, you throw them away... which is one reason I switched to ehfisynth = cheaper :)

Personally, I prefer the ceramic rings, or ehfimech, over the grob.. the grob is too messy to deal with for me :( but that's just a matter of personal taste. Besides, I really think it's meant to replace the blue pads and not the "noodles" but again, I could be wrong.. Since the blue pads last so long buying replacements isn't as much of an expense as buying the pre-cut fine pads would be.

Sounds like you've got a great cleaning and WC regimen going... you think it's ugh w/ a 29, wait till you get your 70.. lol You may want to start using pumps if you haven't already, makes life a whole lot easier :)

Keep up the good work, and keep us all posted :)

Jim

[sidra]

You are right about the grob. According to Eheim, it can replace the blue pad. However, the guy at the lfs is the one who recommended it instead of the ehrimech. His tanks and fish all look clean and healthy, otherwise I would've dismissed what he said. However, being the skeptic that I am I only replaced half of the ehfimech with the ehfifix/grob. I did put the grob on top of the ehfimech and then the blue pad, then the ehfi-substrate. I'll give it a try.

As far as what I called the "bio pads" poor terminology on my part. I do mean the fine ehfisynth pads that go on top, but to retain as much friendly bacteria as possible I liked the lfs guy's idea of using the two pads and only thoroughly cleaning one at a time.

(okay, yes, I DO have the Eheim box in front of me for correct spellings :p ).

Thanks again.

[Cosmo]

Hey Sidra, don't worry.. took me a long time to get the spelling right too lol

If you can clean the ehfisynth well enough then I guess it wouldn't hurt.. looks too grubby to me to even try, but if it works will save you some $$. I removed all but about an inch of the ehfimech from all my cans and used the extra room to add more ehfisubstrat - think that'll buy more bio capacity than recycling the ehfisynth. Might not want to try that though until you get some prefilters on the intakes... not sure if you can buy prefilters that will fit the green intake tubes that come with the filter, you may need to try your hand at home made ones.. Carol Roberts has some great advice on that :) If you do, make sure the sponges you use aren't pre-treated with any sort of chemical or you'll lose your fish :( You might check with John at Jehmco.com as he has a pretty wide assortment of sponge filters and prefilters... a veritable fountain of knowledge too and a nice guy..

BigAlsOnline.com has the best prices I've seen on Eheim parts and supplies. They also sell the cannister clips, and having them onhand can be a lifesaver if one ever... ohhh, say falls off and goes down the drain :p (thank god I had bought some spare clips beforehand.. lol).

Jim

[Cosmo]

Just as a follow up to our previous discusion. Just finished cleaning the cannister that I had used ehfifix in instead of the blue course pad.... verdict is, I'll never use ehfifix again :( Not only was it a mess to cut and put into the cannister, but trying to remove the substrate was much more difficult :( and, I found substrate had fallen thru the ehfifix into the ceramic rings "noodles.. lol".

Could be I'm doing something wrong... but, I'll be ordering more blue course pads tomorrow...

JMO :)

Jim

[sidra]

Awwww....Geeeeeez....here we go with the efhifix, ehfimech names again.

I haven't taken my cannister filter apart since we last discussed this. It's been just about two weeks. But now you've got me curious. I just fed them their bedtime snack of flakes and tucked them in for the night so I won't bug them now, but tomorrow I'll take it apart and check it out.

I do have to say though, that my tank is very very clear since I modified what's in the can. From the bottom up to the top, this is what I have:

Ehfimech (the ceramic noodles)
Ehfifix/Grob
Blue course pad
Ehfi-Substrate
TWO fine pads

The tank looks great...we'll see what the inside of the filter looks like.

I know what you mean about cutting the Ehfifix. I have to be particularly careful because if I leave a stray piece on the floor my cat thinks its grass and eats it. Then I find "things on strings" in litterbox. Sorry, probably TMI.

I'll keep ya posted. Hey, what's "JMO"?

Kristen

[Cosmo]

Kristen,

JMO = just my opinion ( I hope lol)

Regarding your cat, sounds like a handy way to insure easy pickup of solids :D

Jim

[sidra]

Jim,

I'd like to say my filter experiment was a success. My media modification combined with daily water changes has kept my tank crystal clear with no floatie things. I opened up the canister this morning and there was about 75% less junk floating around in there. The media is now catching it instead of letting it go back out into the tank.

I did get an extra shower out of the process (see hose mishap post).

Four healthy discus and a very clean tank. The discus gods must be smiling.

Kristen

[Cosmo]

Hey Kristen, if it works.. go with it cause that's what really counts :)

Read about your shower.. lol

Jim