Suggestions please.

[troyclark]

Hello all, I have a couple of questions for you more experienced breeders. I have a 125 gallon tank with 14 full grown adult turks. I have been raising these guys for about a year with little results in the spawning department. All within this week I have what looks like 5 pairs developing. One pair layed a large spawn and defended it admirably actually hatching out 20-25 in hard water with high water movement. At least three other pairs have spawned with the eggs being eaten over night. Should I pull the proven pair now or let them spawn a few more times in this tank to strengthen the pair bond. Any help is greatly appreciated. Troy

[hexed]

It will be up to you. I left my pair in with the others until they laid three times then moved them into their own tank because I wanted them to develope a strong bond. So it's really up to you. You can move them now and wait but even though some hatched it still doesn't mean that they will raise them. It took mine a few (3) more tries before getting it right. Then on the other hand, my second pair weren't even a pair but I removed them from my other tank because each was with another discus but constantly fought with the other discus but their mates did not so I put them together in a seperate tank and they have been there ever since. The first time they spawned both guarded the eggs and the fry never attached. The second time the fry attached but the female laid again and she killed all but two fry. Those eggs did not hatch because the male didn't go over the eggs - he had the fry on him. She laid again when I was on vacation but no wigglers, now she is laying again tonight as I type, I guess we'll see what happens. So like I said, it really is up to you - you can leave them to form a stronger bond or you can move them and let them be and they will still form the bond.

[John_Nicholson]

Whether you leave them in with the others or pull them now really does not make a difference. I know lots of people say to leave them in there and let them "learn" what to do. Sorry folks but these fish have brains smaller then a pencil eraser. They really don't learn much. Normally the older that they get the better there instincts work, but that is not learning. That is maturing. If it was me I would pull the proven pair. Let them spawn on there own. If the eat the next spawn I would let them spawn again and then cover the eggs.

-john

[KIWI13]

I know lots of people say to leave them in there and let them "learn" what to do. Sorry folks but these fish have brains smaller then a pencil eraser. They really don't learn much. Normally the older that they get the better there instincts work, but that is not learning. That is maturing.
-john


Well said indeed, fish are not intelligent simply because intelligence is defined by ones capicity to aquire and more so apply a know how or (knowledge) its also based on one capacity to reason. fish just like most other animals have natural instincts. instincts that man once had too but lost due to our evolution. Hence after all my blabber I return to the subject that is, it really doesnt matter if they are in a community tank or in their own little love shack. Its all about your choice and what you choose for them.

I must say havin 5 pairs is a handfull alright and yoru gonna be a busy bee lookin after all those fry once you get these pairs established. GOOD LUCK BUDDY .

;)

[troyclark]

Thanks for the replies. I think I will go ahead and pull them tonight. I have a 29 gallon ready to go. It was pretty cool to all of a sudden see all of the fish in the tank start to pair off. They were schooling as a group one night and the next night they were establishing there own spots in the tank. Alot of sparring going on. Three days later, boom, three sets of eggs layed. The proven female is still "guarding" the dead eggs with her male is stopping by every now and then. He is busy keeping the others away. He is also now starting to clean a spawing cone again. Keeping my fingers crossed. I hope they get it right, I am ready for some babies. Thanks again for the replies.

TC

[JimmyL]

To learn or natural instinct. It's not important. The important thing for the helper is to learn the characteristic of each individual fish. Not 2 fish are alike. Each has their preferences to chose a spawning site,different ways to fertilize eggs. Guarding and fenning eggs. raising fries based on your own set ups, fluke attack and infections and so on. Learning has to be done by the helpers, not the fish. It's an art to observe amd react accordingly. That makes a successful breeder who is adaptable and have enough knowledge to change to acheive the final goal which is to have a brood of sellable juveniles. You can only do all these by separate the pair from the very beginning.
Jimmy.

[KIWI13]

Bravo Jimmy !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!