I need Adivice! From Carol & anyone else too!

[Mughal]

Hello!

I am probably The newest member here on this site. I have ZERO discus right now but am looking to get some. Everywhere I see that the right number of Discus to add is somewhere between 8 and a million. There's so many places to get Discus elsewhere in the world, but not a single store in Utah so I'm going to have to order. Where can I get 8 discus without mortgaging my house and trading in my first born child?

Also I have sand as the substrate for my tank. Is sand acceptable for Discus (I've searched this site as much as I can and found nothing) It's black Tahitian sand which was well washed (by letting water run it through a small pore seive for 4 hours). It is very easy to clean, looks beautiful, forms small wave-like structures according to the filtration, and contrasts well with my Columbian marble motoro rays I have in the tank.

Also, I do have rays in my tank (So now you know they exist) they are about 9 months old and 6" in disk diameter. They stay at the bottom of the tank and LOVE to eat krill, blackworms, and earthworms. Are they going to be a problem to keep with the discus? Naturally they come from the same part of the world and even the same "white" water. I have seen Nothing posted about this issue here. I would NEVER put my piranhas in with the rays altough they come from the same place as well, but what about Discus and rays.

Anyhow please please please Someone answer me!

[shalu]

I found this:
http://forum.simplydiscus.com//showthread.php?t=45424

[RyanH]

If you are looking for wilds, check out Al Sabetta's thread in the vendor section.

http://forum.simplydiscus.com//forumdisplay.php?f=59

Cary at Great lakes Discus has nice fish.

http://forum.simplydiscus.com//forumdisplay.php?f=68

Jack and Willie also have really nice fish.

http://forum.simplydiscus.com//forumdisplay.php?f=64

There are tons of breeders and importers here that would do well for you. Look here for more of them:

http://forum.simplydiscus.com//forumdisplay.php?f=42

If you haven't kept Discus before, you may want to consider keeping them in their own tank until you become more familiar with taking care of them. However their needs are, in many ways, pretty similar to stingrays so you may be all right. For basic husbandry information check out the beginner section stickies.

http://forum.simplydiscus.com//showthread.php?t=27180
http://forum.simplydiscus.com//showthread.php?t=28937
http://forum.simplydiscus.com//showthread.php?t=35043

hth
-Ryan

[Cosmo]

Welcome to Simply Mughal :)

A tidbit of advise I picked up on using sand as a substrate from a friend who used it is to keep it less than an inch deep so you don't develop colonies of anerobic bacteria.

And... some good news that may save you some $$, 6 is actually an acceptable number to start with. RyanH gave you some great ways to get started :)

Jim

[Mughal]

Thanks Shalu, but I need to know how long that set-up worked. If you put in the rays with my Piranhas they look fine and you could take alot of nice pictures too...until you turned out the lights.

Thanks alot RyanH, but:

Al's minimum order is $300...
Cary's stock list was last posted in May
KC isn't much better showing the stock list for June
And as for the other breeders, the only guy seems to be Kumar all the way in Toronto!

I actually even called KC 3 times today determined to buy Discus from them, but no one answered the phone.

Cosmo Jim, Thanks for the info on the sand. Do you know if it's going to stunt the discus growth like Carol suggests gravel does in the beginners section?

[RyanH]

The last time I talked to Jack, he was working 3rd shift so he probably is sleeping when you call. You can try getting ahold of him on the weekends or try giving Willie (Jack's business partner) a call if you haven't already. Here is a link to their website and contact information:

http://www.geocities.com/kc_discus/

Cary typically works in construction full-time in the summer and does more with Discus in the fall and winter. Calling him for availability would be your best bet. 1-586-322-3891

One other thing. If you are unable to pay for good quality fish at this time then I would recommend you wait. You will be much happier buying high-quality fish from a reputable dealer rather than trying to save some money and buying low-grade fish from just anybody. If this is the case, save your pennies and then give one of these guys a call. JMHO.

-Ryan

[Mughal]

Thanks alot for the detailed info. I'll try again!~

[Mughal]

Is Gulf Coast Discus reputable? I saw pics of their Leopards and Wow they look nice. Are those considered quality fish? I went to their website and saw their red-melons. Are those "quality" or should I really be looking someplace else?

[RyanH]

Dan is a great guy. You would do just fine giving him a call. I talked to him on the phone today so I know he's around.

-Ryan

[aquakev]

I am 100% positive that I have seen a few ads from a discus breeder/distributer in utah. I cant remember where right now, but the ad had bold type that said"UTAH-DISCUS" I think from SLC. i will look through my sources/mags. n sites to find it out, but may not bbe able to find time tomorrow.

[Condor]

Thanks Shalu, but I need to know how long that set-up worked. If you put in the rays with my Piranhas they look fine and you could take alot of nice pictures too...until you turned out the lights.

Thanks alot RyanH, but:

Al's minimum order is $300...
Cary's stock list was last posted in May
KC isn't much better showing the stock list for June
And as for the other breeders, the only guy seems to be Kumar all the way in Toronto!

I actually even called KC 3 times today determined to buy Discus from them, but no one answered the phone.

Cosmo Jim, Thanks for the info on the sand. Do you know if it's going to stunt the discus growth like Carol suggests gravel does in the beginners section?

Ryan and Cosmo have hit it on the head. I might add that raising juveniles with a sand substrate may prove difficult for the same reason gravel would as its harder to keep clean than barebottom and is better suited for adult discus. Granted its not as difficult as gravel as most of the waste stays on top, but it would definitely require extra attention. I tried raising fish in a gravel tank and its not an experience I would wish on anyone.

Adrian

[Condor]

By the way, what temperature do your motoro rays require?

[KIWI13]

Welcome to Simply Discus,

I think the majority of good points have already been mentioned, however before you go buying your discus, it would be nice to know just how big your tank is ??

Calculate your discus at 10 gallons of water per adult and do take into account your rays too. You don't want to exceed your bio load.

Dan at gulfcoast discus is a good guy and he has good fish and our Canadian counterparts export ot America too, so check out what fish you want and then contact the person involved.

Good luck

Jason

[K.Fawson]

The company in Utah is at www.utahdiscus.com and there are a couple of
stores that sell them in Salt Lake. I would suggest buying from the breeders
on Simply they have great fish and great service.

[Mughal]

By the way, what temperature do your motoro rays require?

My Rays require between 82-88 Farenheit in temp.

[Mughal]

KIWI, my Tank is a 120 gallon....Do you tihkn that's sufficient for 6 extra discus?



Welcome to Simply Discus,
I think the majority of good points have already been mentioned, however before you go buying your discus, it would be nice to know just how big your tank is ??

Calculate your discus at 10 gallons of water per adult and do take into account your rays too. You don't want to exceed your bio load.

Dan at gulfcoast discus is a good guy and he has good fish and our Canadian counterparts export ot America too, so check out what fish you want and then contact the person involved.

Good luck

Jason

[cobaltblue]

Welcome Mughal.

120 gallon tank would do fine for 6 adults discus, of course this does depend on how many other fish you were going to keep in the tank. How many rays will you be keeping in this tank? Im looking forward to seeing pictures of your tank.:D

[Alight]

Mughal, I live in Park City and have been looking for Discus in Utah for more than a year. K. Fawson, I looked for a Utah Discus site and never found one. Is that site new? I've been to two stores in SLC that have Discus, but they don't look very good. I ordered mine from a place in Washington State, but hadn't found this forum yet. I'd have ordered from some of those on this site if I had found this forum earlier.

Anyway, I have 8 adult Discus and about 80 1.5 inch baby Discus from a Red Turquoise/Red Melon cross that I'm raising to sell around here. They're finally beginning to look somewhat good. They were pretty ugly as small fry!!

The Library on this site http://simplydiscus.com

Will pretty much get you started. If your tank is new, I'd suggest getting some bio-spira, or some filter media from an established tank to get you through the ammonia-nitrite-nitrate cycle, or you may lose those rays of yours.

The rays like the same sort of water, and Discus are pretty non-agressive (I don't know about rays) so I'd guess your rays will be OK, but don't know about the Discus, although I know of people who do keep them together.

As you may have read, sand is not a good idea for growing out juvenile discus. Discus like to graze on the bottom, and really need to do that to get enough food to grow to full size. Food mixes with the sand, and then they aren't interested in it. Also, unless you keep the sand very well vacuumed, it will build up bacteria, and discus are very intolerant of bacteria.

If you want to keep discus, be aware that water changes are a must! With 8 in a 120, as juvies, you' ll be looking at changing 60% of the water at least once a week, and possibly twice a week. For maximal growth at least twice a week.

Anyway, if you want to give discus a try for cheap, and get some of the much more expensive fish after you know you have it under control, PM me and I'll sell you some babies for very little.

If those do well, I actually would like to find a good home for some of my adult Discus (two Royal Pigeon Bloods, two Red Melons, a Red Turquoise, and a mostly black Discus--the Red Turg and one of the Red Melons is a proven pair--they are the source of the babies) so I can concentrate on breeding my Blue Diamonds.

I can adapt the babies to your water conditions for you before you get them.

Most Utah water is very hard and very basic, which is OK if the fish are adapted, and your tank is well cycled (ammonia is much more toxic in alkaline water than in acid water).

[Mughal]

Thanks alot Park City man! That would be so great I can't find the words! Anyhow I have a 90 gallon right now and have the 120 cycling. (I do a fishless cycle which usually takes about 5 weeks, maybe 6 in this large tank) The rays are not aggressive at all and I wasn't planning on keeping any other fish with the Discus...I have some red eye tetras in my 90 now, but will take them out and feed them to my piranhas when I get the discus. I WILL take the sand out when I get discus, but as for now I let my rays play and bury themselves in it.

I go to the University of Utah and therefore have an infinite supply of RO and RODI water. But if you can give me fish that will survive in Utah water that would obviously make me much happier! Thanks in advance call me 801-634-9896.

[Greg Richardson]

Who did you buy from in Washington State?

Your thoughts on them?

Thanks!

[Alight]

I bought them from Mac's Discus last December. I believe there was a thread about them earlier. The fish I got were just as advertised by them, only slightly larger than the size they stated. The were (and still are) in good shape, nicely shaped and have developed quite good colors. All 8 are still alive, and I have two breeding pairs, and I have about 100 babies about 1-1.5 inches from one of these pair.

I had bout of tapeworm in these fish, but I really can't tell where they came from, as I also have a planted tank, and some snails came in with the plants, and snails can serve as a vector for tapeworms.

The have grown to 4-6 inches each, and the two smallest are still growing quite a bit.

I really can't tell the relative quality that well, as I have no live fish in our area to compare them with, only pictures. Some pictures are at
http://www.tropicalfishgallery.com/photo-gallery/index.php?cat=10014

but I haven't posted any recent pictures of the adults. They've grow quite a bit and developed quite some color since April.

[Greg Richardson]

Alight. Going to be fun for you to see how your fry colors up. Let us know when you take more. Check Craigslist now and then. You might find some other hobbyist on there around you.

[Carol_Roberts]

Back to the sand question . . . I've had sand in my african tanks and removed it. All my fish do best in bare bottoms. (I've bred several types of africans too - I have baby Frontosa now) It is much harder to keep discus healthy and eating in a tank with any substrate. Yes, some folks do it, but in the end their fish do not grow as large and if a problem arises it is very hard to treat.

[Mughal]

Thanks Carol, your advice is much appreciated. I've convinced my wife that we should take the "attractive hit" and take the sand and plastic ornaments out for now, until the discus are fully grown.

I agree that the adult discus would be happier and healthier if it were not prematurely stunted. Thanks for your help.