Now what?!

[candyl70]

Hey everyone,
Recently my fish were all sick, and recovered and had been doing well for about a week and a half. Well, my PB that is at the top of the pecking order (and looking really good yesterday) has been lying on his side at the bottom of the tank. I don't expect him to make it through the night... but i'm hoping. What in the world could this be? He is not dark in color, in fact he looks normal. No heavy breathing etc. Poor thing. :(

Ammonia=0
Nitrite=0
Nitrate= less than 12
pH= 6.8
Temp. still at 90 from when sick before

The other 3 are looking great, eating and acting normal. I did a water change (50%) and added some salt. It didn't make a diff.


Let me know if anyone needs more info.

Thanks for the help,
Candy

[Kindredspirit]

Candy!


Dayum, Girl! I am so sorri to hear this! Did you call me last night? Late? I just got home from working 8am-10pm! I am thinking you are readly to pull your hair out, yes??


We will talk~


Marie~:angel:

[RiverCitiDiscusII]

Hey everyone,
Recently my fish were all sick, and recovered and had been doing well for about a week and a half. Well, my PB that is at the top of the pecking order (and looking really good yesterday) has been lying on his side at the bottom of the tank. I don't expect him to make it through the night... but i'm hoping. What in the world could this be? He is not dark in color, in fact he looks normal. No heavy breathing etc. Poor thing. :(

Ammonia=0
Nitrite=0
Nitrate= less than 12
pH= 6.8
Temp. still at 90 from when sick before

The other 3 are looking great, eating and acting normal. I did a water change (50%) and added some salt. It didn't make a diff.


Let me know if anyone needs more info.

Thanks for the help,
Candy

Hello Candy, by what you menitioned it sounds like swim bladder disorder/ inflammation the swim bladder, which can be brought on by increasing the tank's water temperature to quickly as when you were treating your discus for their first illness, which resulted in inflammation of the swim bladder and increase of harmful bacteria in the swim bladder. There has be some success using Trimethoprim Sulfa, or as commonly known as Bactrim, if caught during the onset of this disease. Which you can get locally at your Vet's. Candy you'll only need only one tablet of the medication (the tablet is made up of two medications in one 5mg Trmethoprim and 25mg of Sulfadiazine). Crush 1 tablet into powder and then mix into a 100 grams of food, use beefheart. Feed to you discus twice a day in the morning and evening up to 14 days. Candy, if you have any further question please email. Wishing you and your discus the best........Al

[candyl70]

Al,
He isn't eating. Is there any other way to medicate for this? Now he is up at the top of the tank with his nose pointing up. The temp was at 86 before, and i raised it to 90 pretty slowly, and it has been up since about a week ago. I didn't want to turn the heat down yet incase the last disease hadn't cleared all the way up. Eeeeesh!! I heard about feeding them peas, but again he isn't eating. Help! I hope there is some other way to go about helping him. Thanks for the info, i really appreciate it.


Marie,
I did call last night and left a really short message, maybe i didn't talk loud enough? You're right though, i'm about to pull out my hair.
Talk to ya soon.


Candy:(

[RiverCitiDiscusII]

Al,
He isn't eating. Is there any other way to medicate for this? Now he is up at the top of the tank with his nose pointing up. The temp was at 86 before, and i raised it to 90 pretty slowly, and it has been up since about a week ago. I didn't want to turn the heat down yet incase the last disease hadn't cleared all the way up. Eeeeesh!! I heard about feeding them peas, but again he isn't eating. Help! I hope there is some other way to go about helping him. Thanks for the info, i really appreciate it.


Marie,
I did call last night and left a really short message, maybe i didn't talk loud enough? You're right though, i'm about to pull out my hair.
Talk to ya soon.


Candy:(


Candy, the medication must be taken orally. Another way would be to syringe feed the medication to the discus. Im not sure you are up to this as a beginner or could get the equipment needed to this this kind of procedure. The last resort would be to place the discus into a smaller tank 10 or 20 gallons with a heater set at 86 degress with an airstone set on low, and use 1 tablet per 10 gallons of water. Then do a 50% water change each day and redose only for the amount of water changed. Do this for 5 to 7 days. The amount of tablets you'll need will depend on the size of tank you'll use to treat this fish in. Candy, you should know that this discus was probably already prone to getting this disorder before you ever got him, and the recent illness just pushed him closer to the edge. So, please don't go blaming yourself, I know you are trying to do the very best for your discus. Keep us posted........Al

[Kindredspirit]

Candy~

Listen to me. If you need me to i can come over and we can do this! If you can not get anyone else to assist you, girl. Call me and let me know!


Hang in there http://smileys.smileycentral.com/cat/new/8_22/23_50_3.gif



Marie~

[candyl70]

Thanks Marie.:D
This fish is so strange, i don't have a clue what he has. Today he is looking better, as in he isn't lying on the bottom or floating at the top. I have a little rock cave in the center of the tank for them to hide under and he is there, upright, just hanging out. I am going to see if he will eat anything today, so maybe i can get him to take those medicines that Al suggested. Wish me luck!!


Candy:confused:

[Barb Newell]

Hi Candy, is he bloated at all? Watch for some poop, see what it looks like. What was he sick with before?

Barb

[Carol_Roberts]

Have Epsom Salt (magnesium Sulfate) on hand for the next time . . . .

[candyl70]

Hi guys. He doesn't look bloated. I haven't seen any poop from him but i'll keep an eye out. The meds that Tony gave me were for Discus Plauge 2. One of the meds (there were 2 diff bottles) was called Fungus Cure, and the other was Blackening Panacea. The others seem to be fine, eating swimming etc. The pink ones are black again, but the fish that used to hang back is now the boss and i think since the pecking order changed it may be stressing them out? Does that sound right? I have no clue what is going on here with them. :confused: :(

[RiverCitiDiscusII]

Thanks Marie.:D
This fish is so strange, i don't have a clue what he has. Today he is looking better, as in he isn't lying on the bottom or floating at the top. I have a little rock cave in the center of the tank for them to hide under and he is there, upright, just hanging out. I am going to see if he will eat anything today, so maybe i can get him to take those medicines that Al suggested. Wish me luck!!


Candy:confused:

Candy, glad to hear that the discus seems to be doing better. Hold off on giving the medication, if you haven't already given it. Lets watch the discus for a few days, and see if it will take the regular feedings you provide. And see if it keeps improving on its own. The medication that you received from Tony, might have been a little strong for this fish to handle. So, keep us posted, I'll follow your thread..........Al

[candyl70]

Thanks Al. I haven't added any meds as i don't want to be putting in the wrong meds again. I am just keeping up on water changes and adding salt for now. Good thing i didn't euthanise (sp) him last night. He really looked like a goner, but i had to give him a chance, they seem to get better over night sometimes. I don't have any of the meds that Tony gave me left. Would the strength of the medicine start to affect him now? It has been out of the water for over a week. I put in carbon for 48 hrs. and then tossed it.

I do have another question. My water is stinky. I have cleaned my filter, taken out all the old padding, do my regular water changes (50%) daily, and am careful not to overfeed. Last night after putting in new padding in my filter, i turned it back on. Well all this little white looking stick pieces came out of the filter. I am wondering if i have something in the tubing? Or what that stuff could be and where its coming from. Could that be making my PB feel sick? It smells sort of eggish, or just dirty. I'm wondering if the food just goes bad quicker because of the higher temp?


Candy

[candyl70]

Quick update:
After today's water change and some more salt added, i turned out the lights to watch for a bit and my sick PB came out and was swimming and eating. I don't know what was causing him to lay on his side like that as all water pm's were normal etc. :confused:


Candy

[PJs]

I'm rooting for you Candy (and Ronin). My juvie has also been dark and hanging out under a root, about 10 days now. She breathes fast, didn't seem to respond to gill fluke med or extra salt, and I hate the idea of having to treat her again for sth else like bacteria.

She's not dead at least, but not totally better either. Very frustrating not knowing what to do and not wanting to overdo! It sure is a comfort getting help on this forum, though - thanks to all!

Good luck and hang in there! :thumbsup:

[Kindredspirit]

Ronin & Candy & PJ...

All of you hang in there! You three are going to be pros when all is said and done!!




Marie!http://smileys.smileycentral.com/cat/36/36_7_26.gif

[sh_Discus]

Hey Candy,

You have to be carefull with the ph when using bp(1). we learned the hard way.
it works great, but you must take care with the dosage.

kevin

[candyl70]

Thanks everyone. It is so strange because he is now up and eating and looking good. But i still have no clue what was happening to him. I saw them flashing last night, almost all of them, so i am treating with prazi pro. Maybe that is what was wrong with him? skin flukes?

kevin,
i also got an pH meter, and i was using it the whole time i was treating with the meds to make sure it was stable. it was about 7.3 when i was treating them.
Very strange, just peeked at them and they all look so good, fins erect, nice color. I have no clue.:confused:


Candy

[RiverCitiDiscusII]

Thanks Al. I haven't added any meds as i don't want to be putting in the wrong meds again. I am just keeping up on water changes and adding salt for now. Good thing i didn't euthanise (sp) him last night. He really looked like a goner, but i had to give him a chance, they seem to get better over night sometimes. I don't have any of the meds that Tony gave me left. Would the strength of the medicine start to affect him now? It has been out of the water for over a week. I put in carbon for 48 hrs. and then tossed it.

I do have another question. My water is stinky. I have cleaned my filter, taken out all the old padding, do my regular water changes (50%) daily, and am careful not to overfeed. Last night after putting in new padding in my filter, i turned it back on. Well all this little white looking stick pieces came out of the filter. I am wondering if i have something in the tubing? Or what that stuff could be and where its coming from. Could that be making my PB feel sick? It smells sort of eggish, or just dirty. I'm wondering if the food just goes bad quicker because of the higher temp?


Candy


Hi Candy, I'm very glad to hear that the one discus is doing so much better! As for your filter, seems like the egg smell may have been the beginning of the formation of hydrogen sulfide. Hydrogen sulfide left unchecked could wipe out all your fish. I suggest monitoring your filter a little more closely. When opening a filter it should have clean smell! Candy, I also did some further research, and found out the the Bactrim can be used in the tank water for treatment of swim bladder disease (as well as 1 tablet per 100grams of food) at 1 tablet per 80 liters of water. Also old filter material should be removed from filter before treatment begins. A 50% water change between doses, treatment to last 3 to 5 days.
If Tony should be reading this post, maybe you could have the manufactures list the active ingredients of the medication you originally used, as this could be a safety issue with small children getting into these medications by accident. Candy, keep us posted, I'll follow the thread................Al

[candyl70]

Al,
I have changed my filter alot in the past 3 weeks, to take out the carbon, put it back in, and then to take it out again. lol. everytime i have rinsed out all the padding, and the canister itself. I clean it pretty regularly, about once a month. But the smell is still there, in the tank. I thought it was the drift wood rotting, so i took it all out. But it still smells. :confused: I really don't know what it could be except maybe something in the tubing?But the water pressure is the same. Maybe the medicine was making it stinky... dunno. Do you think i should still use the medicine that you recommended for swim bladder? Thanks for your help Al, i really appreciate it.


Candy

[RiverCitiDiscusII]

Al,
I have changed my filter alot in the past 3 weeks, to take out the carbon, put it back in, and then to take it out again. lol. everytime i have rinsed out all the padding, and the canister itself. I clean it pretty regularly, about once a month. But the smell is still there. I thought i was the drift wood rotting, so i took it all out. But it still smells. :confused: I really don't know what it could be except maybe something in the tubing? Maybe the medicine was making it stinky... dunno. Do you think i should still use the medicine? Thanks for your help Al, i really appreciate it.


Candy


Hi Candy, first hold off using any more medication for now! Secondly I'd get new tubing for the filter, you shouldn't have that smell! And I'm not sure if you continue to use the present tubing that it or won't could cause problems for you and your discus down the road. But why take chances! Change it!! And since we don't know what was in the originally medication, it just might have reacted the with the tubing of your filtering system.............Al

[candyl70]

Thanks Al,
I have been really hesitant to use any medicine, so i have just been using the salt, and doing water changes everyday. I think i am going to go to the LFS tonight and get some more tubing and see if anything changes. As for the contents of the meds, Tony got it from Taiwan, i think , so its written in foreign characters. I don't even know if Tony knows the ingredients. All i know is that one changed the water green, and the other changed the water blue, and that it didnt hurt the corys or the clown loaches. :) Ill let you know if the tubing helps. Thanks again for all of your help.


Candy

[candyl70]

Holy shish.... The tubing has never been cleaned for my canister filter before. Tonight i disconnected it and the sickest looking brownish green stuff was in the tubing. It was what kept coming out of the spray bar each time i disconnected the filter to clean it. It was about the most disgusting thing i have ever seen. My poor fishies... im hoping that this will help them to feel better. I know i will!!!!


Candy

[cobaltblue]

On a fluval cannister filter, how does one clean the hoses out? I too always get a discharge ( quite large sometimes) of really gross white stuff ( almost looks like mysis shrimp) when i fire up the fluval after cleaning...First, is this
discharge bad for the fish, and second, how do i prevent it.
thanks.

[candyl70]

I don't have a Fluvial, but on my canister (Rena xp2) i just pulled the hoses off of the valves of the canister, and then off of the filter intake and spraybar. I'm not sure if it is bad for the fish, but i think it might be. It smelled really horrible. I heard that it is full of bacteria, so on second thought it might be. I really have no clue how to prevent it, but will keep an eye on the tubes, they start to get dark stuff in them, i was told it was just algae, and not to worry, but that was at my LFS. So just keep an eye on the tubes i guess. Does your water smell kinda funny? My sense of smell is really sharp, but my b/f couldn't smell it at all. If you are seeing the discharge coming out, you might have the same build up. Try taking off your tubes and either putting your finger inside, or if you can see inside see if you notice any greenish/brownish looking stuff. Hope this helps a little..

Candy

[RiverCitiDiscusII]

Hello Carol and Chris, seems like the both of you just learned an important lesson when it comes to canister filters. The need to clean the intake and output hoses. I use a filter brush, which you can get at the LFS, cut the small handle off, then use duck tape to attach the filter brush to a wooden dowel which is smaller than the inside diameter fo the filter hoses. This way I'm able to really scrub the inside of the hoses and remove any built up material, which will eventually slow down the intake and output of your canister.
Carol, I'm a little concerned about you having medicated your tank recently and what it might have done to your biological filter. So, I hope you'll continue to monitor your tank's water parameters over the course of the next 4 to 6 weeks. My I suggest that the time you clean your filter, that you give this product a try. The product is Bio-Poly Filter, it removes ammonia, nitrite, nitrate, heavy metals and medications from your tank's water. The best part of this product is that it changes colors when removing toxcins from the water. The packaging will explain what the color changes mean. Candy, I've used this product in all of my filters, in my discus hatchery for over the past twenty plus years! It is such a great product, that I won't
be without it! Hope all is well with you and your discus? Hope that I was of some help to you....Al
:) :)

[candyl70]

Al,
Not to worry, i have been keeping a close eye on my water parameters. The meds that i had used didn't hurt the beneficial bacteria. At least not up to date. The fish are all doing well, eating swimming etc. I guess that is what was making my one fish lye down? My levels were all normal though, so who knows. The water is nice and doesn't smell anymore. The fish are all now squabbling again since the pecking order was disrupted. Its funny to watch them sort it all out. Thanks for your help Al, you definatley helped to keep me calm through the whole process. I'm just glad that i haven't lost any of them:angel: Thanks again!!


Candy

[Kindredspirit]

Good News Candy!!!http://smileys.smileycentral.com/cat/36/36_1_55.gif




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Marie~