What Do I Need to Do?

[Butch]

Hi Everyone...Happy Holidays:antlers:

I have a pair that I don't think should be spawning. I received these
fish July 8th from Jack at KC Discus. He said they were about 2 months
old at the time. That makes these fish about 7 or so months old.
About four weeks ago they laid eggs on the AQ siphon. I did not see
them do it so I was not sure about the sexing. The eggs stayed long enough
for some to fungus, about 3 days, and then they were gone, eaten I guess.
They have just laid the 4th batch of eggs in 3.5 weeks. I have not seen the
eggs change color from a clear/tan to black or dark like they were fertilized.
I am no expert on anything but I don't see how they are old enough to be doing this.
Since the eggs don't change color, my guess is the male is not
mature as of yet. I have see them laying the eggs and the female has a short
stubby tube and the male is pointed and smaller. So I guess I really have a
male and female, I think.
Anyway...do I need to keep letting them lay eggs over and over. Isn't that
hard on both of them? Especially since they are not fertilized?
I sure would appreciate some suggestions on what I need to do. They are in
a 50gal by themselves. The ph is 7.6 and total hardness is 19.5ppm, so I
think the water is OK.
So any suggestions and help would be greatly appreciated.

Butch:)

[Kenny's Discus]

Hi Butch - if you're not in any rush for babies I would recommend you to let them keep trying in the tank until you see wigglers. This will not only confirm their sex but also it's a very good trick to train them as good parents.

In the past my pairs that have successfully produce wigglers in the community tanks needed a much shorter time to "have frys on their back" when they were finally put in the 29gs; whereas pairs that I took out immediately into their breeding tanks when I first noticed the mating behavior needed longer time to get the hang of it(if ever). Hope this helps.

Kenny
http://forum.simplydiscus.com//showthread.php?t=45944

[Butch]

Hi Kenny...sure appreciate your information. Wow....when you took your
pictures you sure had some babies. That one tank looked like it had over
a hundred babies.
Ok...I will just let them do their thing. Are they way too young to be
breeding at 7 months? I am just going to leave them in the 50 by themselves
for right now. I have enough room in the other tanks for the other leopards.

Thanks
Butch:)

[White Worm]

They are kinda young, no problem for the female but I dont think the male has reached the age of being able to fert the eggs. I could be wrong. Kenny is the expert here and I have seen his setup personally and yes, there were hundreds of babies that he is raising. I have one of his proven pairs now in my 35g.Let them practice, it wont hurt them. Even pairs at an older age require some time to get it right. Sometimes 15-20 times so you are lucky to be ahead of the curve. Kenny is lucky though, he has a pair that constantly breeds and three pairs had eggs or fry when I was there plus the 4 tanks full of babies. Good luck, Mike

[Ryan]

Butch,

What type of discus did you get from Jack?

The reason I ask is because different types of discus seem to reach spawning age at different times. I remember Cary telling me that pigeon-based fish seemed to go early, as early as 6 or 7 months. On the flip side, fish like blue diamonds take longer than average for discus, based on posts here I'd say 18 months up to 2 years for fertile eggs and wrigglers.

So maybe it's not entirely too early depending on your fish. Either way, you're still getting close. I noticed spawning behavior in my fish from Al (wild green X snakeskin) around 9 months old or so.

Ryan

[Butch]

Hi Mike and Ryan, thanks for the info. Ryan they are leopards from Jack.
I just went and checked the 4th spawn and the eggs are gone. They laid
them Saturday 12/3 in the evening. I never saw a color change in the eggs,
like they are supposed to do just outside of 24 hours when they are fertile.
So....I guess they are not be fertilized by the male. There were a bunch
of them this time. I wonder which one of them is eating them? During the
week I don't get to see them until about 4:00 in the evening since I leave
for work about 4:30am.
I sure appreciate the info. I received a breeding cone today I had ordered.
I put a 2" piece of PVC in the tank and they have ignored it, so I will wash
and place the cone. Maybe they will use it instead of the AC siphon tube.
Thanks again to everyone.

Butch:)

[hexed]

Butch,
I would suggest you contact Jack and ask him. He would be able to give you better info about your pair. 7 months and breeding, I would really think that they are older and Jack can answer that for you. He might have got them mixed up or something. I leave my breeding cones in the tanks to get my discus to pair off but at 7 months they are more interest in food and chasing each other all over the tank LOL!

[Butch]

Hexed....thanks for pointing out my stupid. Jack was at work but
I talked to Willie and indeed the Leopards were older than 2 months.
He said they were early breeders and to just let them go. My cone
arrived today and I washed it and put it in the tank. They have been
spending time looking it over real close. The female is getting right up
close and checking it out. Maybe they will use it the next time.
Anyway, thanks for the suggestion.

Butch:)

[Kenny's Discus]

Mike - I'm far, far away from being any kind of discus expert. I do know I'm really in love with these wonderful creatures, and I'm sure you can relate to that! :-)

Butch - I agree totally with hexed that the pair are probably older than 7 months old. (possibly around 9 months old?) Regardless just let them "do their thing" and I'm sure as you might have already heard b4 sometimes it does take quite a few times for them to learn what they are suppose to do. (especially the male)

I guess at the mean time, enjoy and watch the SHOW!

Kenny

[White Worm]

Overall, you are lucky to see some breeding activity. I am patiently waiting for my wonderful pair to procreate (do the nasty).

Kenny, dont be so humble, I saw your setup and you definately know what you are doing. Not to mention, you are very open and sharing with your knowledge. It is very much appreciated. I posted more pics of your pair,,,,,oops,,, MY PAIR!! LOL. I hope to be soon the owner of some new fry. I am patient though because I know they have to get settled in. I have them in a little higher traffic area, do you think that will make a huge difference?? Sorry to hijack this thread. I know you had them up high but they see limited traffic when we are in the bedroom. What do you think Kenny??

[Kenny's Discus]

Sorry about hijacking this thread 2 myself. I will make this quick here... :-)

Mike - regarding the placement of the breeding tank, I think it all depends on the pair. Some pairs don't really care about traffic while others are more sensitive/nosy. As I've told you b4 your pair would only lay eggs behind the brick because IMO they are parents with high protective instinct. In this case I'll say give them a little more time so that they'll be more at eased with the new environment b4 you decide to place them higher?

Thanks,

Kenny