View Full Version : Is it just me....
Squiggy
10-03-2006, 12:45 PM
...or has anyone else viewed the winners at Duisburg and wondered how/why some of them were chosen? Especially in the wild classs...I've seen far better fish posted here at Simply. The 3rd place winner in wild caught breedings has washed out color, irregular bars, and just an overall muddy appearence...(IMO)
http://worldshows.discusnews.com/duisburg06/winners/wild-breedings.shtml
Lee....you need to think about getting over there next year...:D
pcsb23
10-03-2006, 12:51 PM
I'd have the 2nd place fish though in a heartbeat, that is what I would call a belter.
Don't like the 3rd placed one either, so no its not just you ;)
Squiggy
10-03-2006, 12:54 PM
Paul...did you check out the other categories? Many of the wilds are not what I expected to see as winners....
pcsb23
10-03-2006, 01:00 PM
Joe, I did and I had a lok at the winners in other categories too. Persoanlly felt there were better discus on display than some of the winners, although I can also see why some won, even if I didn't like them.
Personally think there are different standards at each show, and therefore different judging criteria too.
I was a bit surprised at some of the winners and placings, but have to say too that there were some awesome fish on display as well. Wish I could have got there, maybe next one :)
Kindredspirit
10-03-2006, 01:05 PM
Save your pennies for the ACA....in SacTown...2007:) Paul!
Marie ~ http://smileys.smileycentral.com/cat/29/29_5_2.gif
pcsb23
10-03-2006, 01:10 PM
Save you pennies for the ACA....in SacTown...2007:) Paul!
Marie ~ http://smileys.smileycentral.com/cat/29/29_5_2.gif
I'm saving them :) Duisberg is every 2 years anyways (at least I think it is)
LizStreithorst
10-03-2006, 01:28 PM
We'll be in SacTown next year, but I REALLY want to save my pennies for a trip to Singapore. I'd love to see Roy Khoo's fish in person.
I didn't agree with a lot of the placings either. It seems to me that the shape was lacking in some of the fish. But one example of a fish that could have a better shape that I am in awe of is the 3rd place Open fish. I wonder if the owner, Tony Tan is a relative of Mark Tan?
Kindredspirit
10-03-2006, 01:37 PM
Oh goodie Liz;)
Tony_S
10-03-2006, 01:46 PM
Nope....it's not just you Squig....
There were 3 or 4 categories that made me wonder what the...????!!
3rd and 4th place Discus that where FAR superior to 1st's and 2nd's.....
Tony
turkis
10-03-2006, 01:57 PM
I wonder if the owner, Tony Tan is a relative of Mark Tan?
Tony Tan and Mark Tan (Tan Chee Lok) are not related.
:) :)
Squiggy
10-03-2006, 02:05 PM
Liz...I agree. Thats one gorgeous fish. Great photo, too....
I'm glad I'm not the only one confused by the judging...good to know I still have at least one foot on the ground....:crazy:
What is the 3rd place discus in the Open class? That is a gorgeous discus and I have never seen one like it. It looks solid white.
I also think that the 2nd place Heckel in the Wild-caught Breedings category is a beautiful fish, though there is a slight hump in its forehead right before the start of the dorsal fin.
Ryan
turkis
10-03-2006, 02:54 PM
What is the 3rd place discus in the Open class? That is a gorgeous discus and I have never seen one like it. It looks solid white.
I also think that the 2nd place Heckel in the Wild-caught Breedings category is a beautiful fish, though there is a slight hump in its forehead right before the start of the dorsal fin.
Ryan
Ryan,
The fish that won 3rd place at the open class is an albino Blue Diamond from Tony Tan of Ipoh.
Mario
:) :)
sleonard
10-03-2006, 03:21 PM
What is the 3rd place discus in the Open class? That is a gorgeous discus and I have never seen one like it. It looks solid white.
...
Ryan
That one caught my eye as well. Where can I get some of these?
Ryan,
The fish that won 3rd place at the open class is an albino Blue Diamond from Tony Tan of Ipoh.
Mario
:) :)
It's a beautiful fish. Does the albino gene actually remove the blue color from the fish, or is it just a very pale blue?
lhforbes12
10-03-2006, 03:23 PM
Can't see the winner well enough to judge. #2 is stressed and still looks gorgeous. #3 is probably a better looking fish than the picture suggests, #4... Wild caught? Could have fooled me.
It looks to me as though they were judging strictly on coloration, and whether it was high bodied. Odd choices in most categories.
LizStreithorst
10-03-2006, 03:24 PM
That one caught my eye as well. Where can I get some of these?
Good luck on finding some of those. But if you do, put me down for as many as my credit card limit will allow.
turkis
10-03-2006, 03:48 PM
It's a beautiful fish. Does the albino gene actually remove the blue color from the fish, or is it just a very pale blue?
Hi Ryan,
They are of very pale blue colour, I'll post some of the 2" fish pictures If I can find them.
Mario
Timbo
10-03-2006, 03:54 PM
ever been any reported cases of judges being bribed for these events?
Dkarc@Aol.com
10-03-2006, 03:58 PM
That one caught my eye as well. Where can I get some of these?
Not many breeders are doing these. And those that are breeding them are selling them for hundreds of dollars for a small 2" fish. I was last quoted from a big Penang farm 1,500RM for a 5cm albino BD....that's roughly $400 USD for a fish that is barely 2". Personally, I think it is one of the most beautiful discus ever created yet.
-Ryan
Kenny's Discus
10-03-2006, 04:04 PM
Hi Liz - sorry for the confusion and I truly can understand your concern in regards to your question of whether they're related. I want to thank Mario for his clarification(while I was sleeping) that Mark Tan & Tony Tan(of Ipoh) are not related. Please accept my apology for the confusion on the other thread Liz.
Sry for cutting in...back to your show winners.
Kenny
Elcid
10-03-2006, 04:52 PM
Haha, well check the judges names ;) When the pick good ole Peter Thorde as a judge, anything goes! :)
HTH,
Sandeep
Tony_S
10-03-2006, 04:56 PM
Haha, well check the judges names ;) When the pick good ole Peter Thorde as a judge, anything goes! :)
HTH,
Sandeep
:confused: Last I'd heard, Peter Thode was Ill and couldn't attend....did this change?
Tony
pcsb23
10-03-2006, 05:16 PM
:confused: Last I'd heard, Peter Thode was Ill and couldn't attend....did this change?
Tony
No it didn't change the judges were
Mr. Jeffrey Chin Siong Tan (Malaysia)
Mr. Johnny Yip (Hong Kong)
Mrs. Annie de Maesschalk (Belgium)
Mr. Kuo Yun Kuan (Taiwan)
Mr. Horst Linke (Germany)
Mr. Dr. Vlado Bydzowsky (Czech Republic)
Mr. Sebastiano Solano (Italy).
Not sure if the president judged too Mr. Bernd Degen (Germany).
btw Mr. Horst Linke (Germany) replaced Peter Thode
turkis
10-03-2006, 05:45 PM
Hi Liz - sorry for the confusion and I truly can understand your concern in regards to your question of whether they're related. I want to thank Mario for his clarification(while I'm sleeping) that Mark Tan & Tony Tan(of Ipoh) are not related. Please accept my apology for the confusion on the other thread Liz.
Sry for cutting in...back to your show winners.
Kenny
Albino BD's were sold for $150.00US each for a 2" fish and will post some pictures later.
Hi Kenny,
You are finally awake and it has been a long day.
Take care
Mario
:) :) :)
turkis
10-03-2006, 06:11 PM
Haha, well check the judges names ;) When the pick good ole Peter Thorde as a judge, anything goes! :)
HTH,
Sandeep
Hi Sandeep,
Peter Thode has been a judge for years at the Duisburg Discus Show.
Mario
:D :D :D
Elcid
10-03-2006, 06:35 PM
Hey Mario:
I had the good fortune to meet him. He talks so much but not much about discus :)
take care,
Sandeep
turkis
10-03-2006, 06:40 PM
Hey Mario:
I had the good fortune to meet him. He talks so much but not much about discus :)
take care,
Sandeep
Hi Sandeep,
It is a long story and I knew the man for 25 years.
How many times he spat at your face while talking to him.
:) :) :)
Mario
brewmaster15
10-03-2006, 07:02 PM
I think I will Hold all my comments and criticisms on Judging at these shows until the day I am experienced enough for The Honor of Being considered for this..... Conservatively speaking, I figure I have many decades to go still, many bridges to build, and fences to mend.:) What an honor that would be, should that day ever come.
Looking at so many beautiful discus must be daunting.
-al
Elcid
10-03-2006, 07:42 PM
Hey Mario:
Maybe I should clarify my comment about Peter :). We had gone to see his hatchery and he invited us for lunch at his home. He is quite a character and can chat up a storm, especially with the young lady travelling with us :).....Anyway after a very long time we were wondering if we were ever going to see his hatchery which we did and ofcourse he was more excited to tell us about his cows :)....He is a very nice guy though just a bit ecentric ;)
thanks,
Sandeep
wolfbane
10-03-2006, 09:39 PM
Are Discus shows kinda like dog shows? It depends on the attitude as well as the conformation, and sometimes its your day, sometimes not.
turkis
10-03-2006, 09:59 PM
Hey Mario:
Maybe I should clarify my comment about Peter :). We had gone to see his hatchery and he invited us for lunch at his home. He is quite a character and can chat up a storm, especially with the young lady travelling with us :).....Anyway after a very long time we were wondering if we were ever going to see his hatchery which we did and ofcourse he was more excited to tell us about his cows :)....He is a very nice guy though just a bit ecentric ;)
thanks,
Sandeep
Hi Sandeep,
I have never seen his hatchery and in the old days he used to import a lot of discus from Germany. He is getting old and that's why he is just a bit eccentric.
Mario
Elcid
10-03-2006, 10:35 PM
Hey Mario:
Peter was/is no small hobbiest. His hatchery when we visited it, umm I'd say around 1998, was very big. I would say atleast 5000sqft. The amazing thing was that he had tanks mounted above large basins of water and he had HUGE peat filters! It was interesting to see his ceramic bowls for artificial rearing of fry and of course his cows were very friendly :)
take care,
Sandeep
...or has anyone else viewed the winners at Duisburg and wondered how/why some of them were chosen? Especially in the wild classs...I've seen far better fish posted here at Simply. The 3rd place winner in wild caught breedings has washed out color, irregular bars, and just an overall muddy appearence...(IMO)
http://worldshows.discusnews.com/duisburg06/winners/wild-breedings.shtml
Lee....you need to think about getting over there next year...:D
I was also a little confused and disappointed:confused: . I also agree I've seen far superior discus posted here, then again Simply is not the best Discus board for nothing;)
Lee, you really would make a killing in that show!:D
Nope....it's not just you Squig....
There were 3 or 4 categories that made me wonder what the...????!!
3rd and 4th place Discus that where FAR superior to 1st's and 2nd's.....
Tony
Same here.
Save your pennies for the ACA....in SacTown...2007:) Paul!
Marie ~ http://smileys.smileycentral.com/cat/29/29_5_2.gif
Yes looks like we all should save our pennies for the ACA, although for many of us pennies alone won't do much;) :D
I only REALLY liked the 2nd place open class discus from Roy Khoo, 3rd palce open class from Tony Tan, Jorg Stendker's 2nd place pigeon and a couple of other Tony Tan's discus(not all of them)
April
10-04-2006, 02:11 AM
i think i know what ryans next fish is gonna be....
Only if you're buying them for me, April. lol. They are beautiful but I can't afford discus like that.
Maybe in 5 years when they become common :)
brewmaster15
10-04-2006, 02:32 AM
That First place Fish in the Reds... I have been looking for something like that for years!... Having a tank full of them would be amazing!!!
-al
LizStreithorst
10-04-2006, 08:44 AM
That First place Fish in the Reds... I have been looking for something like that for years!... Having a tank full of them would be amazing!!!
-al
Wouldn't it be amazing? What do you figure are the genetics of a fish like that?
I'll take a tank full of those Reds and a tank full of the Albino BD's.
brewmaster15
10-04-2006, 09:09 AM
Hi Liz,
That fish looks like the San Merahs That used to be around....Now most San merahs I see are small and runted. , mostly rose reds, .and they rarely are seen with that deep deep blood red color.
I have no Idea what that fishes genetic make up is...But It definetly reminds me of those old San Merahs that I loved , and still do.
-al
pcsb23
10-04-2006, 09:14 AM
Are Discus shows kinda like dog shows? It depends on the attitude as well as the conformation, and sometimes its your day, sometimes not.
According to the senior judge for the UKDA show yes they are, if the fish displays it will do better, in fact that is one of the categories the UKDA will judge on.
That First place Fish in the Reds... I have been looking for something like that for years!... Having a tank full of them would be amazing!!!
-al
Al all I can say is each to their own :) but not for me, now the third place fish in the Browns or the 1st placed fish in the Striped Turquoise would be nice.
As for any of the greens :vomit:
None of the greens looked good to me. One had terrible shape!
I am with Al... I love the "original" San Merah. That one has a blue face. You can really see the ghost discus influence in it, which if I'm not mistaken, ghosts were used to remove the striations and bars from the faces of San Merah. I'm not a huge fan of the dented chin thing, but I see more and more discus with that and I guess I'll have to live with it. Otherwise it looks like a beautiful fish.
Ryan
brewmaster15
10-04-2006, 09:43 AM
The Greens as a group are notorious for having the least desireable shape of the wilds....They are usually collected for spotting..thats where their real value lies to most...
I have seen some better than those...but all in all.. Those are not bad specimens of wild RSGs.. Spotting aside... The fish that took 3rd place... that metallic Blue color is very hard to find these days... Thats a terrible picture...but I think that fish is far better than shown and It certainly is unique among the others for its color.
I'll take a tank of them as well:)
-al
pcsb23
10-04-2006, 09:44 AM
None of the greens looked good to me. One had terrible shape!
I am with Al... I love the "original" San Merah. That one has a blue face. You can really see the ghost discus influence in it, which if I'm not mistaken, ghosts were used to remove the striations and bars from the faces of San Merah.
At least we won't be fighting over them then ;) It is a nice fish in most repects, its just not the type I like, probably was a worthy winner too.
I'm not a huge fan of the dented chin thing, but I see more and more discus with that and I guess I'll have to live with it. Otherwise it looks like a beautiful fish.
Ryan
It is considered less of a flaw by European judges now for sure. I don't like it either and believe that it is primarily a function of growth rate.
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