glow in the dark Discus?

[brewmaster15]

Hi all,
Just a hypothetical question but one that I am pretty sure somewhere down the line we will face...

If a Glow in the Dark discus was developed, would you buy them? Its not that far fetched really...the technology is there...and its been done already with other fish...You just need a well financially backed breeder and an aquatics lab.... The potential here for sales is awesome...no hormones needed to market to petshops, hardcore hobbyists could spend $$$$ on them.

By day your common Red mellon, by night a solid neon yellow...or better yet, a common red turq but imagine that pattern glowing an eery yellow or green.


SOOOO<< would you buy them? where do you personally draw the line...is it bulldogs? batdiscus? albinos? or maybe its the undeveloped market sensation... Glow Discus? Just curious....Its all a matter of preference but interesting nonetheless.

-al

[pcsb23]

Al, have you come off your medication??
:D

[mikeos]

Better up the dose Al....:D

Not a hope in hell of me ever buying such fish, I draw the line at any major defect or deformity.

[Tony_S]

SOOOO<< would you buy them?

I'm really not sure at this stage....sitting on the fence for the time being.
I'm typically not against color variations in discus, or any other fish for that matter, just deformations of any sort...buuut...these go a little beyond simple color changes, and open a whole new door (which has already been opened as you mentioned) to Bioengineering.

With that said...about two months ago? Cary Told us he was going to send us some glowing pink Zebra Danio's...I initially thought....whatever, and shrugged it off. I'm not a big fan of Zebra Danio's, and even less so with the color pink. But when these things came out of the bag and into the tank, I was amazed....the color is unreal! A really cool little fish!

Funny though....as many times as Ive stared at the Danio's in amazement, until your post here, I never made the connection with Discus!!?! Your right though, It's completely doable...And I'm sure it's just a matter of time.

Couple of links for others to read through...

http://www.glofish.com/

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Glofish

Tony

[CAGE-RATTLER]

Just curious if anyone has tried using a blacklight on a tank of solid white discus. (or other bright colored discus)

We all know how white T-Shirts, teeth or what have you will glow under a blacklight and was just curious if the white fish would also glow with a blacklight?

As to the poll and question ............. The only way i would purchase a glow discus is if i knew for sure the discus wasnt being harmed in any way and it wouldnt affect the life expectancy of them.

[dishpanhands]

I saw in the pet store the other day that they now make the glow fish in other colors. now I saw yellow, green, and orange. Its just a color that glows under black light. it is part of there DNA it won't hurt the fish. its not like they are trying to paint them like they do lots of other fish. Only difference I see is one nature morphed and one man helped nature morph. I'm OK with it as long as they don't mess with the shape. these fish and all morphed fish should never be returned to the wild. IMO.

[Timbo]

if they can do it for condoms...

[Marinemom]

I'm not sure about the glow in the dark discus but it does sound a little strange. Maybe it is best not to mess with Mother Nature. We would be better off not to get her angry.

Diane

[korbi_doc]

:crazy: :crazy: :crazy: :crazy: :crazy: :crazy: WHOOPEE!!!!!!!!! Technology Rules!!!
Al, maybe you should check, Valium would help, lol....
Yeah, I probably would go for it if they were indeed pretty to look at..but then I am a crazy old lady!! ROTFLMAO!! Dottie :crazy: :crazy:

[LizStreithorst]

Whadda ya say we slip him some Dormator, Dottie. It's reversable. We could wake him up to eat and post, then give him another shot to knock him out again. BTW, as embarressed as I am to admit it I'd probably go for Glow in the Darks. Had to vote "not sure" though.

[traco]

Or you can cheat and get the LED moonlights (mine is blue). I love when the blue turq swims under it! Gives off some neat color!

[poconogal]

Or you can cheat and get the LED moonlights (mine is blue). I love when the blue turq swims under it! Gives off some neat color!

Oh yeah! I have moonlights also, and any of my discus that have light markings glow under the moonlights!

I'd think about getting glow in the dark ones...

[ronrca]

Guess Im more of a naturalist! Keep it pure and simple for me. I like untampered fish! Its a matter of preferance just like silicon enchancements, lifts and tucks, etc(nonmedically related). :D JMO

Id be also concerned about any side effects over time. Its always over time when complications come to light! :p

[Squiggy]

Will these be wild glow in the dark discus? :inquisitive:

[ronrca]

Will these be wild glow in the dark discus? :inquisitive:

Only if there is a nuclear plant near by or a radioactive source perhaps~! :p

[korbi_doc]

Whadda ya say we slip him some Dormator, Dottie. It's reversable. We could wake him up to eat and post, then give him another shot to knock him out again. BTW, as embarressed as I am to admit it I'd probably go for Glow in the Darks. Had to vote "not sure" though.

:D :D Ok Liz, I'm in, & I have it at the "ready"....watch out Al, we're after ya!! lol, all in fun, huh??? BTW, I threw caution to the winds & voted yes, why not???.....but then I'm crazy....:crazy: Dottie ;)

[ShinShin]

Are you kidding me? I wouldn't even buy a bulldog much less a freak like that.

Mat

[Owl]

No way Jose !!

[mmorris]

Never Never Never! What is the matter with us when the paint-box Mother Nature gave to the discus isn't enough? Martha

[belonosox]

Having breed color variations, hypo/hyper this or that and or albino corn snakes, after a while I got turned off to them and found myself not breeding or buying corn or other snakes that were purposely breed for such variations and drawn back to the natural colored ones of which there is enough variations. If we try hard enough I'm sure that the genetic basis for the naturally occuring variations could disappear. Glow in the dark Discus remind me of "Parrot Fish" etc. where body deformities make for a grotese looking fish. Anyone seen natural colored angels lately in the stores let alone ones whose fin and body shapes are even close to natural. Would hate to see Discus go futher down the road. The white Discus seem to be the most inane change, if I see one more amelalistic or albino fish etc I'll be needing some strong psychiatrice meds. Just call me Mr. Natural.

[Green Country Discus]

Al, Al, Al, how does the song go...roll another one my friend....:p . I am proud to vote NO way...as for YOU others including AA....:confused: . Good question though Al LOL.

[swinters66]

I'm not really sure on that one...I mean...2 of my discus are a bright orange...not sure if that color is "natural" and my blue (diamond?) is a nice bright blue...again..."natural"??

As long as the fish itself wasn't bred or engineered in a way that would harm the health of the fish...I'd check them out. But don't know if i'd buy one....

[Elite Aquaria]

After giving it some thought I think not...I think it would make a strong fish look like it sold out...LOL

So no for me!!

Dan

[brewmaster15]

well,

My current med dose is right on track as long as the forum is online.:)

How about this one...


A current bioengineering focus is to breed the cold hardy genes from the fish... winter flounder into fruits and vegetable....particularly tomatoe varieties... going for a cold hardy tomatoe.


so... how about a less dramatic change in discus... breeding lines of cold hardy Discus from genetic bioengineering... think about how cool it would be to have the discus you have without the high tank related electricity? The new cool water discus could live comfortable at any range of temps above freezing and below Boiling !:D:D:D

-al

[Tony_S]

so... how about a less dramatic change in discus... breeding lines of cold hardy Discus from genetic bioengineering...


Thats Interesting. Now that you ask THAT question, I have to stop and wonder if it's the glowing discus aspect of it, or the actual Bioengineering that turns people off?

Would the same people who object to a glowing pink or green discus, object to a Nice Red Melon Type as well?

Tony

[brewmaster15]

Hmmm... The meds must be working...see Brew not crazy...he thinkin just fine:)

-al

[tony1313]

Glow in the dark... Hmmm that means the lights would be off! Sure why not, anything to cut back on those HUGE electric bills.

;)
Tony

[dishpanhands]

What if somebody just found a discus that glowed in blacklight nobody did anything other then good food and water to get this fish. no lab, no chemicals, no dies nothing just another color would everybody still hate it? or is it the messing with the DNA that nobody wants?

[pcsb23]

A current bioengineering focus is to breed the cold hardy genes from the fish... winter flounder into fruits and vegetable....particularly tomatoe varieties... going for a cold hardy tomatoe.

cold tomatoes?? you sure the meds are working? Seriously though genes from flounders in tomatoes worries me as much as (unnaturally) glowing fish. I used to live too near to Selafield a nuclear re-processing factory that discharged into the Morecambe Bay, saw too many deformed fish....



so... how about a less dramatic change in discus... breeding lines of cold hardy Discus from genetic bioengineering... think about how cool it would be to have the discus you have without the high tank related electricity? The new cool water discus could live comfortable at any range of temps above freezing and below Boiling !:D:D:D

-al
IF they could do it by selective breeding and NOT messing with its gene structure by implanting new genes or changing existing ones by so called engineering then maybe, but a genetically modified discus? No Thanks.

[pcsb23]

What if somebody just found a discus that glowed in blacklight nobody did anything other then good food and water to get this fish. no lab, no chemicals, no dies nothing just another color would everybody still hate it? or is it the messing with the DNA that nobody wants?

Well considering the pigeon blood is derived from a mutant, and that is what I think you are meaning, then maybe, but probably still not. And yes I personally am against messing with the DNA.

[LizStreithorst]

Hmmm, this topic is getting more and more interesting. IMO, there would no other way to create Glow in the Dark Discus but through bioengineering. IMO, bioengineering is playing with fire.
Look at what we have done to dogs through simple selection. Hip desplasia is common in the large breeds. Eye problems (pra) and knee problems are common in small breeds. Y'all don't know about goats, I'm sure. But a brush goat can survive under any conditions. Dairy goats were derived from these. They are bred to be elegant loking and to produce copious amounts of milk. Disease resistince and parasite resitance simply disappeared. And all this is because of simple human selection rather than natrual selection.
Would I go for glow in the dark Discus? Well, we've been bioengeneering produce for a while now and we haven't paid the price yet. I have pink Danios ordered from Cary. When something is cool, it's hard to pass up. As long as what we are messing with hasn't caught up with us yet, I would probably go with it.

[Darren's Discus]

Bring it on i say ! as for messing with mother nature isn't that what is happening with all these new strains any way.what do you think hormones and colour enhancers are ? how many people have bought beautifully coloured 2 inch discus only to find them loose there colour anything that raises awareness to the hobby is a good thing,can't live in the past so put me down for a dozen glow in the dark juvies when yours are ready al !



cheers
(iv'e been known to glow after a big nite out)

[LizStreithorst]

Bring it on i say ! as for messing with mother nature isn't that what is happening with all these new strains any way.what do you think hormones and colour enhancers are ? how many people have bought beautifully coloured 2 inch discus only to find them loose there colour anything that raises awareness to the hobby is a good thing,can't live in the past so put me down for a dozen glow in the dark juvies when yours are ready al !
cheers
(iv'e been known to glow after a big nite out)

No! Up until now new strains have been developed through human selection.
Color enhancing foods are one thing. Hormones are another bag of worms. Why do you feel that you can put them in the same catagory?

[Darren's Discus]

even human selection is messing with mother nature,dont get me wrong i'm all for it.but basically isn't it like an arranged marriage it's not nature taking it's course hormones and colour feeding are in the same bag.

cheers

[brewmaster15]

Hey Paul,
check this out... I wasn't kidding on the flounder gene and tomatoes...

http://www.geo-pie.cornell.edu/media/fishberries.html#f1

it wasn't exactly a success but this sort of manipulation is done all the time.


But...its been done with salmon..They put the antifreeze genes from flounder into them... so why not discus?
1: Mol Mar Biol Biotechnol. (javascript:AL_get(this, 'jour', 'Mol Mar Biol Biotechnol.');) 1992 Aug-Oct;1(4-5):309-17.

Hew CL (http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?db=pubmed&cmd=Search&itool=pubmed_AbstractPlus&term=%22Hew+CL%22%5BAuthor%5D),
Davies PL (http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?db=pubmed&cmd=Search&itool=pubmed_AbstractPlus&term=%22Davies+PL%22%5BAuthor%5D),
Fletcher G (http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?db=pubmed&cmd=Search&itool=pubmed_AbstractPlus&term=%22Fletcher+G%22%5BAuthor%5D). Research Institute, Hospital for Sick Children, Toronto, Canada.
Salmonids freeze to death if they come into contact with ice. Many marine fish species that inhabit icy sea waters synthesize antifreeze proteins (AFP) to protect them from freezing. Production of stable lines of freeze-resistant salmon and other species would greatly facilitate development of sea-pen aquaculture in many regions. We successfully introduced winter flounder AFP genes into Atlantic salmon. Research to date indicates stable genomic integration and low levels of expression of winter flounder AFP genes in a small number (approximately 3%) of salmon developed from microinjected eggs. Inheritance of the AFP gene by offspring (F1) from crosses between transgenic and wild-type salmon revealed that the transgenic flounders (F0) were germ-line mosaics. Low levels of AFP precursors could be detected in the blood of all these transgenic offspring (F1). Approximately 50% of the progeny produced by crosses between transgenic F1 and wild-types contained the AFP genes. These results demonstrate that stable germ-line transformed Atlantic salmon can be produc

Heres a better one to ponder... In an attempt to make corn crops more resistent to insects...and more productive... The corn crop was genetically modified to express a toxin that is used commercially to kill bugs...its called BT... This Toxin is produced by a bacteria...Bacillus thuringiensis. Miilions and millions of these plants are used yearly.. The idea is the insect pest ...in this case a corn borer will eat the plant and die and without any pesticides being applied to the crop...

http://www.pnas.org/cgi/content/full/171315698v1

I wonder if BT works on Flukes?


okay last one... How about a discus that would grow up to 5 times faster... sci-fi? nope... Theres a salmon developed that has the genes from an eel like fish that confers super growth rates on the salmon. Just think how much more spawns you could get from your pairs.. of course theres a trade off in size...These fish are not as large when mature... but how would anyone buying fry from them know that anyhow?
http://www.mindfully.org/GE/2003/From-The-Gene-Lab14may03.htm


I have a feeling The next 5-10 years are going to be real interesting in terms of GMOs (genetically Modified organisms)

-al