DISASTER = New Begining?

[diskboy]

I have been having terrible troubles with my tanks and just recently lost everything. The clurprit? ICH! It all started in my saltwater tank when I noticed that I had just lost my snowflake eel, and one damsel. I had no idea what was going on, my last damsel looked good and was swimming eating nothing seemed wrong. Next day wham he goes down along with my 4 year old bristlenose plec (my baby), I sat there for probably 3 hours trying to decyfer why they were all dying, I figured I would yank up the temp. from 84 to 86.....days went by no one dying so I figured it would be safe to lower the temp back to 84. Just as a percaution I ran out and bout some Furan 2, and some stress gaurd, also some internal parasite medication, just in case things started to get fuzzy again. Well we just recently went on vacation last week and I told my grandmother (animal care taker when away) that if anything looked weird in my tank to call me. Well tuesday she called and said that my little blue fish (blue ahli) had died and that the others were hiding behind the sponge filter. I asked her how they were acting....she described my gorgeous snakeskin as black and was breathing heavely....I knew it was probably ich and to drop 5.5 tablets of furan 2 into the tank after letting it dissolve in a cup of water and jack the temp up to 86 again. She did so and I left it at that, she said everything looked fine after a couple of days so when I came home I was expecting to see my beautiful babies all waiting to see daddy, but what I came home to was a shock. I came home to a very dead Red Marlboro discus.....and a very dark deathly looking Snakeskin I was in shock I asked my grandma how they were acting that morning she said they were out and about eating what I told her to feed them and everything else. Confused I did a small awtopsy and found that they still had ich....so I threw the rest of the tablets into the tank and prayed that she would make it threw the ordeal....yesterday morning I woke to her also dead. I feel so terible that I couldnt do anything to really care for them and treat them while I was gone....since then I have drained all the tanks and disinfected them with hot water and salt. This was the worst thing to happen to me in my years of fish keeping.....I still love keeping discus very much they are beautiful fish no matter how you look at them. Now I can not lie I have not been so good on doing water changes as my life has been very hectic since the move to our new house and after settling in this past month I have been able to do 50% changes daily and feed them 3 times daily. I would like to start over with a new batch of 4-6 juvies with new fitlers, heaters, lights, ect. I want you guys honest opinion....If I am faithful and read...read.....read as much as I can before plundging in again.....get the right equipment...and stay faithful to water changes everyday of 50%+ can I pull of this project of starting new?

I would appreciate any knowledge wisdom....I have two empty tanks 20 gal, 55 gal. I would also like to note I only want to keep the discus till' they are full grown, no other fish and when they are done growing and pairing off I could try some cardinals or something. Thanks alot guys.

Please burn me if you will on my ways I have done wrong I know I have but hope this leason as something to learn from not dwell on.

Thanks all,
-Kevin

[Don Trinko]

I am no expert but I would start by cleaning both tanks and filling with water.
You might also consider your 20 gal a hospital/quaranteen tank. Then start slow with cheap fish untill your tanks have cycled. Then proceed slow. Ick if caught in the early stages can usualy be curred with malachite green or several other chemicals. Keeping the temperature a little on the high side sometimes helps keep ick from getting started. Good Luck; Don T.

[brewmaster15]

Hi Kevin,
Sorry to hear this...Not sure what you had happen as a disease but The Ich that salt water fish get is not the same as freshwater Ich, and even if it was.. The furan 2 was not going to be effective against it...its not a good anti-parasitic.

my best advice... bleach everything and start clean slate..I think you know whats the best way to go about this right?:)

I say give it a second try here...just keep it simple and you should be okay.

hth,
al

[diskboy]

here is my plan.....I have a job and am getting another one soon as I pass the test to become a lifeguard so I can work at my school pool. I save my money, I won't have to save much for supplies but the fish I will.

her is my supply list

1x 55 gallon tank (main tank, already have)
1x 20 gallon tank (quarentine/hospital tank, already have)
2x NEW! sponge filters
2x NEW! 200-300watt submersable heaters
cartridges for emperor 400

thats the supplies I need
now how many fish should I get?
I was thinking in the 4-6 range.

I want to get them in the 2-3in. range so they are cheaper and I can work on the water change sqedual. I really like BD so I plan on getting them all BD which will also cut down on cost since they are pretty cheap these days.

I have a automatic feeder....so when I am gone during the day at school the babies can get the food they need. The feeding squedual I hope for is, as soon as I get up feed some frozen blood worms, afternoon flakes and granuals, some CBW when I get home, some more flakes a couple hours after, and some more FBW before they get their WC of 50-75%.

foods I plan on using

-Frozen Blood Worms
-California Black Worms
-Colorbits
-Tetrabits
-Tetramin
-Sprinula Flakes (on occation)


does this should ok to you guys?
as I asked before should I start with 4 or 5-6?
I would like to add tetras and some cories later on.

also another note. If I stay saving after I get the fish and everything running I can get a 125-150 gallon in a year, in a year i'll have about $2,000 and I want to do a nice planted tank for them.


Thanks for the help Al and Don apperciate it.


-Kevin

[brewmaster15]

Hi Kevin,
I'd take my time and start with 8 Bds in the size range you wanted here... By the time you have adults you'll probably have 5-6 adults that you like.

Buy all the Bds at the same time...same seller...and then the 55 becomes both QT and main tank.

hth,
al

[diskboy]

do I just give away the other 2-3 BDs? or keep them for when I get the 125?

Thanks,
-Kevin

[brewmaster15]

Probably lose one or two along the way...one may not grow as well as the others... Then again all 8 could be perfect...but....its better to start with more and all from the same supplier than add a piece here and there as time goes on...


-al.

[diskboy]

I had planed on buying all at once, once I found a good price.

-Kevin

[diskboy]

Would it be ok if I add a piece of drift wood to the tank but still kept it bb?

-Kevin

[brewmaster15]

yes,
but I'd wait until after you qt them 4-6 weeks... just in case theres a problem and you need to treat with a chemical.

-al

[Graham]

''...Confused I did a small awtopsy and found that they still had ich...''

Hi kevin not sure what you founs but an autopsy wouldn't have revealed ich. A simple visual look or a scrape and scope of the live fish would have ID Ich. Also the Furan is an antibiotic and will do nothing to very little to a protozoan parasite, which ich is.

Good luck the second time round but I'd suggest one less fish and a good book on fish diseases in it's place

[Ed13]

Hi Kevin,
my best advice... bleach everything and start clean slate..I think you know whats the best way to go about this right?:)

I say give it a second try here...just keep it simple and you should be okay.

hth,
al
great advice right there, just in case it was something else behid the ick
It also sounds like you are suffering from MTS, better keep things as simple as possible, may be its time to evaluate if you can seriously keep up with multiple tanks

good luck, i've been there before and the thought of starting fesh kept me going

[Don Trinko]

Is BD blue diamond? I'm not up on all these abreviations. I have 4 Blue diamonds. I prefer the old BD , Brow Discus. Don T.

[brewmaster15]

Hi Don,
Yes...BD= Blue Diamond:)

-al

[diskboy]

Thanks for all the replies.....I hope starting off new will keep me motivated in the fish hobby...not to long ago I felt like just dumping the load off to a buddy and being done with fish....but one night I sat down and looked at them watched their personalities and the thought of getting rid of the was totaly out of my head and I fell in love all over again. I thought the disease which killed most of my fish was ich but for all I know the discus and a couple others could have had internal parasites....this time around I will stick to the KISS method and just relax.

Thanks all,
-Kevin

[hexed]

Kevin,
What fish were in what tank? You said the damsel died the next day with the pleco, were they in the same tank? You kept saying she dropped 5.5 tablets into the tank so where exactly are the saltwater fish, after all they were the ones dying? After reading your post it sounds like they were all in the 55 gallon together. Not once did you mention treating the twenty gallon tank. :(

[April]

well dont give up..we have all lost fish..and started out on the wrong foot.
listen to advice..and learn. get your fish from a good source all at the same time as was suggested. any questions..just ask.
thats how we all learnt.
sorry for your losses.

[Darren's Discus]

Diskboy,
sorry to hear about your loss but as April said we have all lost fish just remember lose fish not faith ! learn from mistakes and jump right back on that horse better prepared than the first time !

all the best.

[tdr1919]

Something to mention is that ICH is most likely from temperature changes. You mention 50% water changes, all well & good if the water temperature is the same as your tank temp. if not you can certainly wipe out your fish.
- Tom

[alxjss]

Kevin,
What fish were in what tank? You said the damsel died the next day with the pleco, were they in the same tank? You kept saying she dropped 5.5 tablets into the tank so where exactly are the saltwater fish, after all they were the ones dying? After reading your post it sounds like they were all in the 55 gallon together. Not once did you mention treating the twenty gallon tank. :(

DISKBOY,
I WAS WONDERING THE SAME THING. CAN U TELL US?