One by One,Discus Dying

[youngdiscus]

One By One my Discus are Dying, All will seem healthy then One will get sick and dye then another gets sick and dies, and this has been continuing.. just woke up too another dead discus today..

but i have noticed the discus which are getting sick and dying havent grown since i accuiried them, they where stunted and generally unhealthy from the start.

All in the tank seem healthy for now.have noticed growth and color improvement in these.,

if this trend continues i dont know what too do. Have no idea what is causing this?


I have always had an extremly high PH, dont think that would kill them though would it? 8.5/8.6

I have noticed white stringy feces, but dont think internall flaggs kills this fast?

anyways the symptoms before death are, they stop eating, become extremly weak, lose all color and turn completly white body and eyes, sometimes large black blotches on fins will occour..

I thought it was weird that all color dissapered in the body and eyes turning the fish completly white, then after death the color reappeared?????

But anyways,, thanks, i hope someone knows what may be the problem

[steve.ryall]

Can you post up all your other water quality/test readings, ok we know your ph, but the experts will need more to give you a reason. What is the temp? What is your water change regime?
How big is the tank? How many fish? etc hth

Steve

[brewmaster15]

How long has this been going on in the tank and how often are you talking about on the deaths?

-al

[youngdiscus]

The temp Is 82/83, Amm-0 NI-0 Na-.5..cant recall water hardness, i know its not really hard but not the softess either.. There are now only 6discus is 135gallons changing 50% water every 3rd or 4th day, feed 3times a day bloodWorms twice and brine once.


I think 3 or 4 discus have died since moving too the new place
This seems too have started since i moved into my new place mabey been living here 2months or more.. the deaths are mabey 2weeks too mabey 1month apart. All same symptoms before death. not eating and really week. loss of color, not active and sitting near the intake filter

although i couldnt see the water being diffrent from the last place, I moved only 5/10minuts away from the city, this is still city water here though,, no Well

[pcsb23]

I am not sure why they are dying periodically. The symptoms are a bit strange to say the least. Fish will lose their colour when stressed, as for it coming back after death - well who knows. I know that normally discus go dark when stressed, but this sounds like a catastrophic stress, possibly due to internal organ failure, e.g liver/kidney/heart. The white poop could be down to flagellates, internal bacterial infection, other internal parasites like nematodes or just simply not eating. You mentioned there was no growth and that these have been sickly, I suspect this could be down to nematodes, but its specualtion. I would also be verys suspicious of your water, though I would have expected a more general effect, it would be worth checking with the water co to see if they have added any extra chemicals recently.

[youngdiscus]

Thanks pcbs, I have no idea either, and found it strange aswell.. i think i will go and ask the water co , mabey they did add something..

But yes, since getting these fish there has been pretty much no growth at all. and they have been with me since just before christmas or after. all the ones that havent grown have now all died.. the others in the tank have all shown good noticabel growth. still eating and active at the moment

there is only 1 red turq which im concerned about now, showing white feces. but other then that fine..

Im just worried about thses ones getting sick now and dying off one by one, by whaterver was causing the others too die

[youngdiscus]

:mad::mad::mad: Well, another is on its way out:mad::mad::mad:

And this time its my Blue turq female.

I just dont get it, I dont know whats going on:confused:

I feed good, I change the water. I give the best care that im able too, and all these discus want too do, IS DIE...

this will be the Last time I get discus from the sources I aquired these ones from. Stunted, football shaped and always sick... but it was my first attempt at these fish and didnt know any better

Boy it get discouraging when you have too fight sickness after sickness.

Im thinking of ordering some Metro and fluke tabs and treating the whole tank.... Anybody else have any idea's?

[Don Trinko]

Prazipro is for some interna parasites and is one of the safer meds.
Gel tek makes a gel that you put on the food that has prazi,metro and something else in it. The white fecees is not normal for healthy fish. good Luck; Don T.

[youngdiscus]

I know the white feces is not normal, but i just didnt think a internal parsite could kill this fast,, I,ve just lost five fish one by one very fast.. The one now that is sick, was perfectly fine, had no white feces ate good and was active, now not eating and just hovering there.

[dvarnay]

I know the white feces is not normal, but i just didnt think a internal parsite could kill this fast,, I,ve just lost five fish one by one very fast.. The one now that is sick, was perfectly fine, had no white feces ate good and was active, now not eating and just hovering there.

I don't know about the other symptoms but I had a red turquoise female bloated with white feces and I treated her with epsom salts to clean her out and then soaked frozen blood worm in water with a ground up praziquantel tablet for an hour and fed it to her. She is now ok. I repeated the soaked blook worm again after 2 weeks. Hope this helps. And good luck.

Cheers
Debbie

[Kindredspirit]

this will be the Last time I get discus from the sources I aquired these ones from. Stunted, football shaped and always sick... but it was my first attempt at these fish and didnt know any better



Unfortunately, this could be a wise decison:( I hope things are better!

[Ardan]

Hi,
Definately check on the water with the city.

Maybe switch food. Will they eat tetra bits?
Put them in a different , clean tank. (maybe bacteria??)
Hard to say, but start with clean tank, clean water, clean food.

Always best to buy from a reputable dealer and get fish that are good shape and health.

hth
Sorry about the losses

Ardan

[pcsb23]

I would seriously consider seperating these fish from your other previous healthy discus, even if it means culling them. Harsh I know but sickly stock remains sickly stock ime and there is no point risking previously healthy stock.

[Cosmo]

My suspicions run along the same lines as Pauls. Water is the primary suspect and I've always associated loss of color to organ failure too, ran into it with two instant death events I had a couple years ago (never had the fish tested to confirm the cause of death).

just a few more notations..

1 - even moving a few blocks in some cities could mean your water is coming from a different pumping station. You didn't mention how you do your water changes or what if any conditioner you use

2 - They may not be dying as fast as it appears if they've been carrying whatever is killing them since you first aquired them. Considering the direness (is that a word?) of your situation I would treat with salt and full dosages of both metro (stringy poo) and prazi (no growth) if it were my tank/fish. Levamasol may be a better choice over prazi in this instance, but I'v never combined that with metro so I don't know how "safe" it would be.

If worms come out, and it sounds like they may... have a good antibiotice on hand (kanamycin or Marycin1 &2 ) to treat any secondary infections.

Since these meds aren't cheap you may have a difficult decision to make :(

Jim

[youngdiscus]

for water changes, I submerse a maxijet into the tank with hose attached and drain out the window, for refilling, i have a 55gallon tank and 40gallon rubbermaid which i age the water in for 1 or more days..I have a submersible 1 1/2hp pump, i use a id breaded pvc hose too pump water too tank.. I was changing ever 3rd or 4th day, as i only have 6discus now in a 135gallon barebottom.

For the meds,, they shouldnt be a problem this time, my check is all clear, so will be buying alot of metro and other meds too last me.

Ill start with the salt right now and up water changes, untill meds are avaiable.. Ill also check with the city water when i have time,, ill let you know.. thanks

[youngdiscus]

What is the recommended salt dosage?

[hexed]

Hi,
I use 1 tablespoon per 5-10 gallons

[youngdiscus]

The only salt i have is a box of, Windsor Iodized table salt.. good enough????

[Deadwood]

Be careful of plastic garbage cans and hoses try to use food grade. If the Rubbermaid smells like plastic when you open the lid I would ditch it.

Les

[Polar_Bear]

The only salt i have is a box of, Windsor Iodized table salt.. good enough????

Most salt is fine, including iodized. The one thing to stay away from is those that have an anti-caking agent.

[youngdiscus]

hmmmm Another unexpected death........... This time my pleco died for no reason at all........


I,ve emailed the city water and am still waiting for a response,

heres the link for the city water qaulity, do you guys notice anything that may be the problem.

http://www.citypa.ca/TheCity/Departments/PublicWorks/WaterTreatment/WaterQualityData/tabid/176/Default.aspx

[pcsb23]

There is nothing in that data to concern you. I suspect it is "averaged" data and not specific for a given day or period of time.

[youngdiscus]

I just checked my storage water in my 55gallon. the surface is scummy/slimy... yet the barrel right next too it is fine.. I just cleaned the 55gallon out last weekend with water and a rag.... so mabey my pump that i leave in there is releasing something into the water.... ill have too check on this

[youngdiscus]

I just finished the water change and the water in the main tank is now almost a murky green.. It must be the pump or python hose or my Pvc braided hose that i leave in the tank.. one of these could be the problem?? Im removing them tonight and refilling barrels, see if this makes any diffrence

[pcsb23]

algae bloom?? - guessing really.....agree with your course of action, you may want to sterilise evrything too.

[Tropical Haven]

The one thing that I haven't heard you mention about is when your water is in your holdong tanks, do you treat for chlorine & chloramines?

[youngdiscus]

No i do not treat the water, I thought letting it sit for a couple days would be good enough? Isnt it...


I,ve recently started with daily or second day 50%/80% water changes and adding 9tablespoons of salt after each water change.. 100grams of metro on the way, will be treating the whole tank.

Since upping water changes and adding salt, my blue turq hasnt been getting worse but hasnt been getting better either, its more active now but still not eating. I,ve noticed a very slight fin degeneration, nothing too worry about i dont think..

[Ardan]

Hi,
After reading in your link, it appears they only use chlorine.


I had a bad experience with aging water in the barrels, all the chlorine did not dissipate , I now use a dechlorinator.


In your case I would bleach the barrels and hoses and pump.
Flush with lots of water and lots of water, use lots of dechlor and flush this too down the drain. flush again (must clear all bleach)
Then start with fresh water and use dechlor for a water change.

I would check the stability of your ph. If it is stable (doesn't change, compare from the tap ph, then let sit in a bucket overnight and check ph again, if no change it is stable)
If your ph is stable no need to age the water. Use it from the tap and add dechlor. You will eliminate bacteria and algae in the barrel. This "may be" the problem.
hth
Ardan

[youngdiscus]

No my ph is not stable, straight from the tap it is 7.8/7.9, overnite it rises too 8.5/8.6...well the cleaning will have too wait for next weekend, wont have the time today lots of yardwork.. Although i have cleaned out the fx5 today it was really dirty rinsed all sponges in tank water, I just cleaned it out a month before and dirty that quick,, mabey might have too start cleaning every 2weeks...

[youngdiscus]

Could it have been possible that during the move, lots of beneficial bacteria died off in the process, causing a mini cycle? stressing the fish, then resulted in sick fish?... although would it affect the fish when there are large water changes frequently?

[Ardan]

I would test the water for ammonia and nitrite.
Ardan

[youngdiscus]

Checked water......I can never really read the color in these test's(salifert) but Amm and NI looked too be nothing... The NI color changed slightly Mabey 0.1 or 0.25.. Ill have too do another water change and test the NI again....

[youngdiscus]

boy i sure would feel bad if this has been the reason for the last couple of months.. i just assumed my water/beneficial bacteria would still be good, as the tank was already established for quite some time. and isnt very stocked, 7 discus in 135gallons

[AADiscus]

One thing to remember with young discus like this is you can't be clean enough! Your water will foul up faster than you think. That why it is important to clean everything daily.

[youngdiscus]

I cleaned the Fx5 addded an air pump and I,ve been changing the water alot now, day before yesterday 60%,Yesterday changed 90% and today 75% .. been adding Prime water conditioner, water has been aged overnight for ph, heated too 82 and a filter running on aging tank. The discus now seem more aggitated or sick after each waterchange .. Only 3 of them have any real appetite.. Water comp hasnt gotten back too me on water results/qaulity....

just tested amm and NI again from tank water and tap water, both results come up clear so i dont think theres a problem there...

Should i treat with fluke tabs then when metro arrives treat with this, then possibly a maracyn 1 &2 treatment, to rule out all sickness?

[Ardan]

well the cleaning will have too wait for next weekend, wont have the time today lots of yardwork..

Clean the barrels and hoses and pump first.

Don't start with a bunch of meds until you are sure its not the water or the equipment. too many meds in a row is not good.

hth
Ardan

[AADiscus]

I agree with Arden, do not start throwing med's in there. This will really mess them up. Large daily wc's, and clean, clean, clean!

[Ardan]

Did you just add the "new blue diamond " to this tank?
from the lfs?

Ardan

[Kindredspirit]

I was wondering that as well ~ I think you said you purchased that BD on the 15th from the lfs? Tell me you didn't add it to this tank?