I need emergency help ASAP

[wrangler]

Ok I am a newbie that purchased a discus approx 2.5 weeks ago. Everything started out ok...abeit she was alittle shy. She was eating good for the first 3 days....then she started spitting out everything that she puts in her mouth....she shows an interest in food...but she just spits it out. When I first got her I noticed a small spot on her tail....I thought that it was trauma from being caught in a net and then put into a plastic bag for travel.....I would guess that she is 4.5-5.0 inches across. The store said that they had her for several months and that she was eating great...brine shrimp/bloodworm ect...I purchased the same items to try to make the transition easier for her. Starting several days ago I noticed that she was staying dark all the time, altho she is still out swimming in the tank. Today I notice that she seems foggy....her body seems hazy...I am assuming some sort of excess mucus and it seems to be clinging to her pectorial fin. Tonite she showed NO interest in food. I have moved her to a hospital tank....but i dont know what I am treating her for.

Anyone have any ideas?

BTW I have been doing a 50 WC every 2-3 days
I tested my water and it says
78 temp
10 ppm nitrate
0 ppm nitrite
0 amonia
8.0 pH<-------high I know, but that is out of the tap

This tank if a 30 gallon planted tank with CO2 running every other day, 3 T5 bulbs, 1 T8 bulb, with some platys, guppies, cherry barbs, neons, 1 danio, several amano shrimp, several glass shrimp and a khuli loach.

Everyone else in the tank seems ok and has a great appetite....

I really dont want to lose this fish....but I am not sure what I need to do to treat her. Thanks again!

Tracy

[2sybs]

to start you should raise the temp up to around 84 - 86 deg.
and one of the gurus will be along to help from there.
Ray

[White Worm]

First, discus dont do well with the lower temps. 82 would be the lowest. Some of those other fish can be fin nippers and do not make great tankmates. Dark color most times means stress and by the sound of it, things seem pretty busy in that tank and crowded. Spitting food can be just their way of breaking it down into smaller pieces. They will keep some in. Discus also do better in groups and not really good by themselves. You would be better off getting her/him 5 friends and putting them all in a 55g tank and leave all the others in the 30g. There could be a reaction from C02 levels also.

[Darren's Discus]

Tracy,
you say she's dark and with excess mucus,if this is the case as mike said raise the temp and i would treat with a good anti biotic and keep a close watch on the other fish in the tank where she came from.


keep us posted.


cheers

[poconogal]

First, discus dont do well with the lower temps. 82 would be the lowest. Some of those other fish can be fin nippers and do not make great tankmates. Dark color most times means stress and by the sound of it, things seem pretty busy in that tank and crowded. Spitting food can be just their way of breaking it down into smaller pieces. They will keep some in. Discus also do better in groups and not really good by themselves. You would be better off getting her/him 5 friends and putting them all in a 55g tank and leave all the others in the 30g. There could be a reaction from C02 levels also.

As Mike said, your temp is too low and I feel that most of the tankmates are not suitable with Discus; they have different temp requirements and Barbs as well as the Danio are very active and can make the Discus nervous, aside from possible fin nipping from the Barbs. Another good point is that your Discus has no other Discus and they usually do not do well by themselves. 4-5 other Discus would be best in a 55 if you have the room. 5 are the minimum recommended number as Discus can be aggressive amongst themselves and with 5, it will serve to spread any aggression around instead of having one fish be the constant recipient. Your PH of 8 is fine.

Its good that you've moved her to a hospital tank. I'd keep the temp around 84 (dont' want the temp too high in the case of bacterial infection) and would treat with Maracyn and Maracyn 2 together, with a 50% WC daily, then redose, as it sounds to me that your Discus has contracted a bacterial infection.

[brewmaster15]

Hi Tracy,

Can you post some pics of the discus?

-al

[wrangler]

Here are a few photos...sorry about the quality....I am still earning how to use my camera.....

The first one is what she looked like when I first got her.....abiet she was showing her stress bars........
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v63/thewranglerorigianl/oct172007003.jpg

The second are more recent......you can see the white film on her pec fins....and today I noticed that she hold one fin at her side and doesnt use it like she should. I also noticed that she is twichy with her tail and whatever those "feelers" are called...like she has something on them and is trying to shake it off.........
You can also see that her fins appear to be shredding wherever that white film has had extended contact with her.......
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v63/thewranglerorigianl/oct172007016.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v63/thewranglerorigianl/oct172007023.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v63/thewranglerorigianl/oct172007027.jpg

I also went back to the shop where I got her to find out forsure that she was eating ok....I was told that they had her for 4-5 months and that she was eating BW/BS(frozen) very readily. I explained what I was having a problem with...telling them that I was doing a 50 % WC every2-3 days...and they about fell on the floor.......apparently they NEVER did a wc...only topped off the tank as it needed it.......and immediatly advised that I stop with the water changes....!!!???? Could her issues stem from the fact that she doesnt like the wc's?? That she was used to living like that?? Anyway it was sooooo not what I have read that successful discus keepers do......thanks again!

[brewmaster15]

and they about fell on the floor.......apparently they NEVER did a wc...only topped off the tank as it needed it.......and immediatly advised that I stop with the water changes....!!!???? Could her issues stem from the fact that she doesnt like the wc's?? Misinformation like that is why discus have a bad reputation as fragile.

Looking at the pics, i'd say the fish is stressed, and possibly has a bacterial issue starting.... Its looking a little thin as well compared to the earlier pics..


I'd ignore everything that LFS told you about discus...

First step here is to get the fishes immune system up...best way to do that is get the fish into water parameters better for it..

The tank temp...shoot for 85-86F... keep the water clean.. and do 50% water changes daily with heated and aerated water...... Hopefully in a few days the fish will turn around without meds... if meds are needed... furan 2 would be my suggestion.


hth,
al

[Tropical Haven]

I totally agree with Al here, turn your temp up around 84 to 86 where it should be and do daily 50% water changes. I would tend to believe that will get your discus back to looking like it should be, also remember to treat your water for chlorine or chloramines before your water changes.

That is why these LFS need to hire people with some knowledge about the fish they sell.

[Anthony]

Tracy,

Sorry for seeing ur Discus into bad health & darken colouration. Firstly, water is a main subject to be taking care of. Secondly I saw ur planted tank are not much taking care of. (sorry to mention) Bacteria also created & invaded, Ur fish shown totally ill, please find a better tank to medication him instead of putting him around that doesn't help at all.

Water change needed imediately basis. There is NO short cut for keeping healthy Discus by daily water change !!!;)

[luenny]

Misinformation like that is why discus have a bad reputation as fragile.

Looking at the pics, i'd say the fish is stressed, and possibly has a bacterial issue starting.... Its looking a little thin as well compared to the earlier pics..


I'd ignore everything that LFS told you about discus...

First step here is to get the fishes immune system up...best way to do that is get the fish into water parameters better for it..

The tank temp...shoot for 85-86F... keep the water clean.. and do 50% water changes daily with heated and aerated water...... Hopefully in a few days the fish will turn around without meds... if meds are needed... furan 2 would be my suggestion.


hth,
al

Just to sideline a bit. Is furan 2 safe for planted tank? Do you need to remove the discus to bare tank before putting in medication?

[poconogal]

Your hospital tank is planted? Hospital tank should be just that, a bare tank used for treatment so that there are no worries about the plants, the sick fish comes first. I'd move the fish to a bare tank. I don't know whether Furan 2 will affect plants, but I think it may affect bio filter, not sure, so you may want to check on that and if you use it, check your water often. I use the Maracyns because IME they have not affected my bio, ever, and I've always had excellent results.

[wrangler]

well it has been 3 days since I moved my discus to a "hospital" tank to treat her....or at least remove her from all other fish....it took about 24 hours for her to stop being black.....and prolly 36 hours for her to actually eat again. I took some photos just now so you can see the diference.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v63/thewranglerorigianl/oct202007001.jpg


http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v63/thewranglerorigianl/oct202007015.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v63/thewranglerorigianl/oct202007007.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v63/thewranglerorigianl/oct202007017.jpg


She alternates from showing no stress bars to showing them...depending on whether or not I am trying to take her photo and how close to the tank I am.......

I think that she looks much better....and i dont seem to notice a haze on her....although whatever that was it has damaged her pectorial fins as well as her tail.......but they already look much better......

BTW how long can a discus remain in a "hospital" tank? It obviously isnt very big and that is why I wondered.....I think that it is a 7 gal....at the most a 10 gal.....but its all I have.....

[2sybs]

Tracy,
You never mentioned it but, Have you raised the water temp in your tank?
When you do put this fish back in your community tank it is important to have that temp up. If it is a problem for you other fish then you will have to decide whether you want Discus in that tank or not but they do NEED a higher temp than 78 deg.
Ray

[Kindredspirit]

I am glad she is doing better! You want to keep up with your wc ~ not to mention keeping that tank clean ~ is that substrate I see?

[wrangler]

Tracy,
You never mentioned it but, Have you raised the water temp in your tank?
When you do put this fish back in your community tank it is important to have that temp up. If it is a problem for you other fish then you will have to decide whether you want Discus in that tank or not but they do NEED a higher temp than 78 deg.
Ray

Yes I did...it is about 85 degrees...and I am doing a 50%WC everyday......

I guess that was the reason that I was asking about how long a discus could stay in a hospital tank.......I am not sure if the higher temperatures will affect my plants and other fish in the community tank........

Thanks for your help!

Tracy

[wrangler]

I am glad she is doing better! You want to keep up with your wc ~ not to mention keeping that tank clean ~ is that substrate I see?

Yes that is gravel.........I wanted a dark background to reduce stress....so there is very thin layer of black gravel on the bottom to make itdark.......its maybe 2 stones thick.

[hoppinhappa]

A hospital tank should be completely bare, with no other fish, as you risk getting other fish sick, or stressing your discus out even more. http://smileys.smileycentral.com/cat/36/36_11_1.gifSome meds will also kill your plants.

Glad to see that she has regained some color.

[wrangler]

A hospital tank should be completely bare, with no other fish, as you risk getting other fish sick, or stressing your discus out even more. http://smileys.smileycentral.com/cat/36/36_11_1.gifSome meds will also kill your plants.

Glad to see that she has regained some color.

Since you are the 3rd person to say something......she is in that tank byherself.......altho there is gravel on the bottom so it will be dark down there.......