Need advice with growing juvies

[Innivus]

Hey all,
Need some advice when it comes to helping my juvies reach full potential. I have 10 discus, 2-4", and the plan is to grow them and select the ones that turn out the best and trade or sell the rest. To get parameters out of the way:

55g, 84deg, 0ppm ammonia, 0ppm Nitrite, approx. 15ppm Nitrate (tough to tell colors on that one), 6.5 pH, Rena X2, HOB filter w/peat moss & bio balls, UV filter, sponge filter, planted w/substrate. I'll do at least one 50% WC/week, sometimes 2 (average about 6 a month).

I feed at least twice a day beefheart mix/worms/Sera staple granules; sometimes three or four times a day, depending on my schedule. Throw in some algae flakes for color (not pellets, floating flakes). For the most part there isn't anything I put in the tank that my discus don't eat. Also, I keep all the food in a certain area (feed by hand or in a floating ring) so all the fish get a fair shot at it.

I've had a good experience with discus so far: i only lost one and that was when I first got them (tank temp too low, it got ick and i was sad. all good since then) What it comes down to is I've had some of these fish for a few months and can't seem to notice much growth. How much/quickly should I be expecting growth? And is it simply that I need to (somehow) feed more? What happens if a discus doesn't grow as it ages? Is there a threshold it will pass and simply not grow past a certain age? Though I don't think it'll happen, but do those variables affect the possibility of breeding?

Ok, I'll stop asking questions and listen to what advice you have. Thanks,

[DiscusOnly]

Welcome to Simply.

What size were the 2" one a few months ago? Did they all started out the same size? Not all discus will grow to the same size but you should definitely see them grow after a few month if they started out at 2". I guess the important question is how OLD were the discus when you got them at 2". My 2.5" grew almost 1/2 and inch (height and length) after only having it for 4 weeks.

[GulfCoastDiscus]

If you want maximum growth at a short time, need to move them to a barebottom tank, 50% waterchange daily and feed 3 to 4 times a day.:)

[Polar_Bear]

If you want maximum growth at a short time, need to move them to a barebottom tank, 50% waterchange daily and feed 3 to 4 times a day.:)

Excellent advice, and I will add that this is the minimum of what I would do. With young discus the rule is food, food, food, water change, water change, water change. Your fish may survive the way you are raising them but they will most certainly not reach their full potenial IMO.

[Innivus]

Hey all,
Thanks for the advice. As I don't have the space I'm not able to put the younger fish in a BB tank, but I'm going to split the 55 I have and make sure they get more than their share of new H2O and food. My one fear is that some of them have gone past their 'growth' stage and are going to present problems in the future. But alas, experience is the best teacher sometimes, eh?

[Don Trinko]

I would add: Get the liquid test kits. They are more accurate and easier to read. Don T.

[Seecher]

If you want maximum growth
in a short time, need to move them to a barebottom tank, 50%
waterchange daily and feed 3 to 4 times a day.:)

Hi Innivus,

The above advise is standard operating procedure for discus breeders who, by necessity, must raise the juvenile discus to sellable size as quickly as possible. It has more to do with the commercial sales of discus rather than the concern about the general health of the young fish.

I would like to offer a different point of view contrary to most posts you will read about on this forum. This is just my opinion. :)

Seldom will we read about the necessity of "growing out" guppies or other tropical fish. For some reason many discus owners want to inflict usual rapid growth to young discus. Is it necessary? Will juvenile discus grow up stunted if they receive a normal amount of food? I suggest they will not. Some discus will grow fast and others not so fast and final results will be size that discus would normally obtain whether or not they are "feedlot" fed as breeders do, or have had just the amount they would consume in a short amount of time.

Another point that should be brought up. It is generally not recommended on this forum to "grow out" discus in a planted tank the usual comment is that a planted tank is too difficult clean. This is true if you are going to engage in a "feedlot" feeding régime. But suppose you just want to feed the juvenile discus the amount they would normally consume in a short amount of time. That way you keep food pollution to an absolute minimum, the young fish will enjoy a semi natural environment, protection and security of plants and you enjoy your young discus swimming among plants and being quite happy instead of living in a watery desert.

The use of Beef heart and other concoctions has more to do with the economical feeding hundreds of fish. Premium commercial fish food available today lacks absolutely nothing,in nutritional quality, to feed young discus and it is much, much cleaner and causes less pollution in your tank therefore keeping a nitrate levels at tolerable amounts. The Beef heart was first used in the dark ages of discus keeping when a selection of quality food, simply, wasn't available. That has changed.

Feeding your discus live food (California black worms, red worms or white worms) will give your fish excellent nutrition and virtually no pollution problems this might be something you should consider.

Good luck with your project and enjoy your fish.

[YSS]

Good post, Seecher, but sounds like the OP has some commercial interests.

[guille2007]

We have a native ciclid here and its named biajaca, it is like oscar but bigger, very similar habitat as discus, little rivers, crystal quiet water, fine grava at bottom, acid and soft water and its meat is very appreciated. When you fishing them you find diferent body size fish with the same eyes size so it aims to same age, what happened there?, some ate more than others, one got more food than others even being at the same place, the same river. This fish also pass for a dry season period, when that happen they even eat palm fruit that drops to the water.

So it depends what kind a fish you want to have, overfeeding is a complex term that would incluide a continued feeding even overnight with light on in order to feed 24 x 24, that's overfeeding, but if you see normal short black feaces from you fish then the digestion process is going fine. Discus is a good fish to detect when you are overfeeding them since they do not go so fast for foods when they are still plenty .

[kaceyo]

Keep in mind when deciding who's advice to follow that Dan has years of experience and has seen the results of many different ways of raising discus through personal experience, the experiences of friends into discus and the many people that have bought fish from him.


Kacey

[Greg Richardson]

Seecher.
The above advise is standard operating procedure for discus breeders who, by necessity, must raise the juvenile discus to sellable size as quickly as possible. It has more to do with the commercial sales of discus rather than the concern about the general health of the young fish.

Not true. That advice is so the average hobbyist can obtain the best growth possible so their enjoyment level is higher.

For most HOBBYIST better color and shape = more ENJOYMENT!



Some discus will grow fast and others not so fast and final results will be size that discus would normally obtain whether or not they are "feedlot" fed as breeders do, or have had just the amount they would consume in a short amount of time.

You obviously have not grown out different batches of juvies doing different wc schedules, amount fed, times fed, ingredients fed.

If you had you'd know as the EVIDENCE is right there in front of you to get maximum growth as a HOBBYIST there are factors as stated here you need to pay attention to.

If you want average fish with high degree of possibly stunted ones then take care of them the way you do.



the young fish will enjoy a semi natural environment, protection and security of plants

Protection from what?
Why do your fish feel the need to hide?
My fish don't have that need.
Your fish not like you?
Do you abuse your fish?
Am I going to have to call PITA? LOL!

Seriously, domestic bred fish have no reason to hide if there are no enemies in the tank. Give them a place to hide and they will.
Natural instinct.

Take it away and once you do the proper introduction of yourself along with your movements, noise, etc. there is no need for that.

Do I enjoy beautiful planted tanks? You bet!
But don't tell the Hobbyist it is best for juvies because it's not. Once older a planted tank is a much better environment for them if that's the type of tank you desire.



The use of Beef heart and other concoctions has more to do with the economical feeding hundreds of fish.

BH is one of the greatest types of food a HOBBYIST can use in order to know EXACTLY what his fish are being fed.

Adding everything from Salmon to worms. The list goes on and on while a HOBBYIST can assure themselves the ingredients are EXACTLY what they are being fed.

Unlike commercial fish food filled with fillers, etc.

And then you have no clue if they are telling the truth what is in it.
Is it really salmon or farm salmon?

The list goes on and on when it comes to commercial food, unlike BH where you can put the BEST of the BEST ingredients in it!


BTW. When you listed California black worms. You might want to tell the hobbyist the dangers of using that food. And no I'm not talking about possible medical reasons that has been debated for years.

You need to inform the HOBBYIST making sure they start feeding that food at night the first few weeks only. Otherwise you eventually will hear about someones fish won't eat anything else but CBW. Once you see they don't go off their feed still eating other food then and only then can you trust your fish.

A lot of people have never experienced this but it DOES happen.

But hey you just go on telling the hobbyist you know best and all this advice has been for commercial discus growers.

Carry on!

[GrillMaster]

Innivus...Welcome to "SD"!! :)

To curb any further arguments, I would just like to say...You will find all sorts of responses to various questions throughout the forum. You will also see that some members are set in there ways, while other members try various ways then pick what works best.

Many members here have been at this for years, while some are just starting out.

So while reading responses to your various questions, keep in mind the experience levels of the ones responding then draw your own conclusions.

Again welcome to Simply Discus! :) Enjoy your stay!

tc
Mark

[YSS]

Understand different arguements on growing and keeping discus. But does an average hobbyist must achieve achieve maxium growth to maximize enjoyment?

I am no expert by any mean, but I have grown juvy discus in my planted community tank with mixed sand and gravel bottom with tons of other fish. I kept up with my water changes and fed them about 4 times a day. March will be 1 year and my guys are almost pushing 5 inches from the head to the base of the tail. Not huge, but a decent size. I enjoy the fish very much and I wouldn't care if they didn't grow anymore.

I still keep up with my water changes (25% every other day) and still feed them about 4 times a day. But if I do more, then the effort required to maintain the fish would take away the enjoyment the fish provides.

Just because you can doesn't necessarily mean you should.

[brewmaster15]

Understand different arguements on growing and keeping discus. But does an average hobbyist must achieve achieve maxium growth to maximize enjoyment?

I am no expert by any mean, but I have grown juvy discus in my planted community tank with mixed sand and gravel bottom with tons of other fish. I kept up with my water changes and fed them about 4 times a day. March will be 1 year and my guys are almost pushing 5 inches from the head to the base of the tail. Not huge, but a decent size. I enjoy the fish very much and I wouldn't care if they didn't grow anymore.

I still keep up with my water changes (25% every other day) and still feed them about 4 times a day. But if I do more, then the effort required to maintain the fish would take away the enjoyment the fish provides.

Just because you can doesn't necessarily mean you should.
__________________ Hi...

First let me say..if you are happy with the results thats great...but It really depends on what ones goals are...


You never mentioned what number of Discus are in that 90gal...?

The member that started this thread has 10 2-4 " discus ina planted 55 gal tank.....and wants growth.... Thats the real issue... most people will not be able to do well with this scenario...


If you want growth and to have many discus in the tank........I'd advise growing out juvies in bare tanks....feed often....change water lots...and then put them in planted tanks if thats the goal.... in the long run you'll be happy..


A general comment on keeping discus... Reinventing the wheel is fun and everyone should have a go at it.....but not in a novices tank, and definetly not in someone elses tank., IMO.

-al

[Kindredspirit]

suppose you just want to feed the juvenile discus the amount they would normally consume in a short amount of time. That way you keep food pollution to an absolute minimum,.

Why would you suggest this to an individual who comes here for proper advice? Do you think that folks here are here just to mis-lead them?

Baby discus need to eat many times per day ~ just like puppies, kittens, and toddlers! They burn a lot of energy and need to eat many small times through the course of the day ~

....everything will grow to it best potential, following this regimen.

This is the very best we can offer juvies of any species! Why can not you get this?

[phidelt85]

This horse has been beaten plenty of times on several other threads. I too recommend that you continue your reading and keep note of who's giving the advice. 99 times out of a hundred you will be adviced; especially with juvies, to raise them in BB tanks with multiple feedings a day and WC, WC, WC. It's the best advice IMO to give someone who may be bringing up juvies for the first time.

I've said this before, I have tried raising juvies in a planted 125, I lost all my original BDs due to it, and my RT and SS are no where near their full potential. Are those two pretty, yes they are but I could only imagine what they could have looked like if I followed the advice that was originally given to me. It is scientific fact (look at studies down on identical twins living or raised in differing environments) that the environment plays a significant role in the development of an animal; it's not all about genetics. Why not give them the best enviroment possible (i.e. very clean water, plenty of available food) to make them the best animals they can be? Then you can pick out the ones you want for that planted tank when they are much bigger and hardier.

[YSS]

Hi...

First let me say..if you are happy with the results thats great...but It really depends on what ones goals are...


You never mentioned what number of Discus are in that 90gal...?

The member that started this thread has 10 2-4 " discus ina planted 55 gal tank.....and wants growth.... Thats the real issue... most people will not be able to do well with this scenario...


If you want growth and to have many discus in the tank........I'd advise growing out juvies in bare tanks....feed often....change water lots...and then put them in planted tanks if thats the goal.... in the long run you'll be happy..


A general comment on keeping discus... Reinventing the wheel is fun and everyone should have a go at it.....but not in a novices tank, and definetly not in someone elses tank., IMO.

-al

Agreed with everything you said. :) I was just making a statement based on my experiences and that not every discus keeper is obsessed with growing his/her discus out to 8+ inches. It may not be clear in my first post, but I do understand that what OP needs is not likely achievable in his current set up.

[Seecher]

As you can see when you offer alternatives to Discus Dogma,
which is based mainly on tradition and discus theology
other than commonsense and available science, you'll have to be
able to put up with the " slings and arrows" of the true believers. :)

I credit the posters of this forum with enough intelligence to be
able to make proper decision about how to keep their discus if
they are given the options available to them.

phidelt85 stated:
"I've said this before, I have tried raising juvies in a planted 125,
I lost all my original BDs due to it, and my RT and SS are no
where near their full potential."

dntx5b9, what does this tell you about phidelt85 ? Is putting
juvenile discus in a planted tank going to kill them? Or is putting
discus in a planted tank and not knowing what you're doing going
to kill them? I leave you to answer that question.

My opinion is just that, I don't hold myself, as some kind of
expert. I think it's important that people actually think about
what they doing rather than raise discus based on hearsay
and dogma.

By the way, I'm really impressed by your signature

- 265G African Cichlids
- 90G Discus Community
- 36G BF Reef
I'll be looking forward to your posts about your discus adventures.

[RyanH]

As you can see when you offer alternatives to Discus Dogma,
which is based mainly on tradition and discus theology
other than commonsense and available science, you'll have to be
able to put up with the " slings and arrows" of the true believers. :)

I credit the posters of this forum with enough intelligence to be
able to make proper decision about how to keep their discus if
they are given the options available to them.

phidelt85 stated:
"I've said this before, I have tried raising juvies in a planted 125,
I lost all my original BDs due to it, and my RT and SS are no
where near their full potential."

dntx5b9, what does this tell you about phidelt85 ? Is putting
juvenile discus in a planted tank going to kill them? Or is putting
discus in a planted tank and not knowing what you're doing going
to kill them? I leave you to answer that question.

My opinion is just that, I don't hold myself, as some kind of
expert. I think it's important that people actually think about
what they doing rather than raise discus based on hearsay
and dogma.

By the way, I'm really impressed by your signature

- 265G African Cichlids
- 90G Discus Community
- 36G BF Reef
I'll be looking forward to your posts about your discus adventures.

The techniques suggested by the majority of people here are based on many hundreds of years of combined experience. IMO this would hardly qualify as "hearsay".

This site has been helping people for several years now. We've seen a lot. Patterns start to develop when you've been doing this long enough. I think the more experienced hobbyists here have a pretty good handle on what works and what doesn't work the vast majority of the time.

I would also question the ethics of someone who would not give a person new to Discus the best possible information that would maximize their chances for success.

[judy]

Your feeding regimen sounds like they're probably not getting enough -- five to six times a day in amounts that don't take then more than ten minutes or so to eat is what you need to see good growth (some people throw in a pinch extra in between as well...) But with that number of small fish in that size tank, and that amount of food, you'd need to pay very careful attention to your water quality. Frequent large water changes (I leave 'frequent' up to others to define -- I do 30% every two or three days, which many would say is not enough, but the water parameters stay solid. However, I have a 78 gallon tank with ten fish in it and I don't feed beefheart) combined with gravel vacuuming daily to get the leftover food and poop off the substrate are a given-- especially if you're feeding beefheart which rots like there's no tomorrow-- within an hour, IME.
Planted tanks and juvenile discus are a tricky combo.

[Greg Richardson]

Seecher.
As you can see when you offer alternatives to Discus Dogma,
which is based mainly on tradition and discus theology
other than commonsense and available science, you'll have to be
able to put up with the " slings and arrows" of the true believers.


If you want to hand out advice be prepared to back up your advice when questioned. As usual when you can't you past on by the post.
Then you make a statement like this above.
So typical of someone who has advice but when confronted about the usefulness of that advice can't debate as to do so would expose all their flaws in their advice.

[rick.c]

blah,blah,blah, do a search and do what works for you or what you think is best and come back tell us how it worked out

[phidelt85]

As you can see when you offer alternatives to Discus Dogma,
which is based mainly on tradition and discus theology
other than commonsense and available science, you'll have to be
able to put up with the " slings and arrows" of the true believers. :)

I credit the posters of this forum with enough intelligence to be
able to make proper decision about how to keep their discus if
they are given the options available to them.

phidelt85 stated:
"I've said this before, I have tried raising juvies in a planted 125,
I lost all my original BDs due to it, and my RT and SS are no
where near their full potential."

dntx5b9, what does this tell you about phidelt85 ? Is putting
juvenile discus in a planted tank going to kill them? Or is putting
discus in a planted tank and not knowing what you're doing going
to kill them? I leave you to answer that question.

My opinion is just that, I don't hold myself, as some kind of
expert. I think it's important that people actually think about
what they doing rather than raise discus based on hearsay
and dogma.

By the way, I'm really impressed by your signature

- 265G African Cichlids
- 90G Discus Community
- 36G BF Reef
I'll be looking forward to your posts about your discus adventures.

It was my experience as a beginner with Discus which cost me alot of money. I don't want someone coming into the Discus hobby thinking they can treat them the same as other juvenile cichlids and attain the same success as with other species. I learned the hard way, and don't want someone else to experience the same troubles I went through. Lucky for me I had a couple of fellow hobbyist/breeders that gladly helped me get back on my feet ( Thank you Andrew and Angela) or I may have not been able to afford to restock my tank. Are you willing to restock someone's tanks that follows your advice and ends up with dead or sick fish?

Seecher, your way of doing it works for you, but guess what? It's not going to work for everybody. You failed to mention that you specially treat your water so you can do it your way. The way that the majority of the folks here on Simply and I'm sure on other Discus-specific forums has been tried and trued. It definitely works. You may not like it, but your entitled to your opinion. ;) Just don't presume to know me because I had a bad experience when I chose to follow a way similar to yours.

[Innivus]

Well, if anything I stirred up a good amount of debate: first off, thanks for all the opinions, and it sounds like the different methods have worked well for everyone here. And certainly, I'm just a hobbyist looking to provide the best conditions and best life for my fish. Nothing more or less, really.

As for me, I don't have the space resources to move all of my juvies to a BB: if I could I would, but it simply can't happen in the apartment I'm in (city life....sigh). What I've done is feed more and increase the water changes, trying to get in at least three or four main feedings with pinches thrown in here and there, WC at least 40%.

Also, as for the beefheart/rotting thing, I got my hands on a recipe from a very good breeder that involved 95% lean beef, some cod, shrimp, paprika and liquid baby vitamins. It's actually loved by the fish and doesn't create the watery sort of mess that beefheart does and the fish get after all the pieces rather quickly and effectively.

some last questions: I get the impression here many people tend to overfeed and use WC as a way to keep the water quality intact...is this a correct reading? And also, what is the scientific purpose of a water change (just very curious)...is it to limit the nitrates in the water?

Thanks again for the responses, I really do appreciate all the advice.

[brewmaster15]

Seecher,



As you can see when you offer alternatives to Discus Dogma,
which is based mainly on tradition and discus theology
other than commonsense and available science, you'll have to be
able to put up with the " slings and arrows" of the true believers. :)

Please stop with the petty complaints about what you have to put up with... You throw as many stones as anyone else... ....You readily dismiss everyone elses experiences in favor of your own as if hobbyists and breeders here are cluesless and mindless followers of some ill conconceived ideologies.....and yet their tanks and fish clearly show otherwise... and then get offended when they reply to your words.

BTW>..I base my "dogma","tradition", and "Discus theology" on Years experience raising and breeding them... I have tried just about everyway of raising them out there...and have a pretty good handle on what works and doesn't under most conditions... I share this with the others here that also have tried it all...

You may not like to hear this or chose to believe it...but advice like you give out Kills or stunts discus....sure it may work for you... but you aren't the one following your advice...in most cases its a novice as anyone experienced most likely would have already dismissed your advice in favor of whats advocated here by the experienced masses.... I know this from over 7 years helping people on this forum, in the disease board, thru thousands of threads, and off this forum.. Dismiss it all as "dogma" if you will....but it works...and works amazingly well.... whereas your methods will not give a high chance of success at all.

One of The goals of this forum is to help people raise discus successfully to be the beautiful kings of the aquarium that they are meant to be....

Seecher, Let me ask you this... If I asked you what is the Best way to raise a group of discus to its largest size in the shortest period of time... what would you respond? I'm not interested what your "personal Dogmas" are on the issue of keeping few discus in a tank alive with minimal food and water changes.......I am curious what you would say to this specific question...


Innivus,

some last questions: I get the impression here many people tend to overfeed and use WC as a way to keep the water quality intact...is this a correct reading? And also, what is the scientific purpose of a water change (just very curious)...is it to limit the nitrates in the water? Fish biology works like humans...the more your body takes in...the more waste it puts out....water changes maintain optimum water quality.



Thanks,
al

[Don Trinko]

My tanks all have gravel and fake plants. (except the Betta tanks) My fish are growing. (started 2 to 2 1/2 now most are 4 to 5 in less than a year) I'm not saying that my way is the best or easiest. It probably isn't.

Greg and the guys and gals are giving good advice.

For me the esthetics of a BB tank were unacceptable so I went with gravel and fake plants. When I did this I realized that it would require more work and there was a higher risk of failer than BB.

I am also not in the "50 to 100% WC per day group. When I did this I also realized that there was a higher risk of disease and less growth. I ultimately ended up going by the nitrate numbers. I keep my nitrates around 5. I have no scientific reason for doing this and will change in the future if it apears neccisary. Don't misunderstand me: FREQUENT WC IS NECCISARY.

Last: In my limited experience it is my opinion that the quality of the discus you buy is just as important. If you get quality, healthy discus you will have less trouble than if you get discus that need medical help from the day you get them. Don T.

[kaceyo]

I am also not in the "50 to 100% WC per day group. When I did this I also realized that there was a higher risk of disease and less growth.
Don T.

Hey Don,
Why do you think this would have increased risk of disease slowed growth? My experience has been just the opposite.

Kacey

[phidelt85]

Hey Don,
Why do you think this would have increased risk of disease slowed growth? My experience has been just the opposite.

Kacey

Kacey,

From what I am understading by Don's statement is that by not choosing to do the 50-100% daily WC, he would be at a higher risk of disease or slowed growth. Correct me if I'm wrong Don.

[Don Trinko]

I think there is an increased risk of disease because it is hard to keep the gravel as clean. With BB you see the crud, with gravel you don't.
Optimum growth: same thing, If you overfeed the gravel will hide it . With BB you can overfeed and suck the excess out in a few minutes. In principle you can do this with gravel but it's hard to know that you overfed.
Having said that I think it is possible to raise healthy, reasonably large discus with gravel. It's probably easier to "push" the 1fish/10g with BB. If I were breeding discus I would have BB for "grow out". For me they are beautifull pets and raising them in a tank with BB and glass walls is not for me. Don T.

[Don Trinko]

I forgot to mention: I don't like the idea of having no place for a shy or picked on fish to hide thus the fake plants. Don T.

[judy]

To answer your question (which preceded the sidebar disagreements above) that you get the impression a lot of people overfeed and compensate for that with massive, very frequent WCs, that depends: with baby and juvenile discus, very frequent small feedings are needed because discus have extremely short digestive tracts. The food goes in, they stuff their bellies, the food gets recycled oout as waste. So its not so much overfeeding as it is providing proper nutrition for growth of the little ones, which results in a lot of poop generated-- hence the frequent WCs: poop decomposing creates the bad stuff:ammonia, nitrite, both of which should stay at zero if you can possibly manage it.
However you do it, you just need to keep the water very clean. I do less frequent WCs which always involve cleaning the tank bottom (I have a planted tank with extremely fine gravel--coarse white sand, really), have triple the biofiltration I need for the tank size, and employ many clean-up crew fish to catch uneaten food that could foul the tank. So my water parameters stay just where they should be.

[Seecher]

Congratulations Judy, what you have described
is damn near perfect fish husbandry. Kudos!

[kaceyo]

Kacey,

From what I am understading by Don's statement is that by not choosing to do the 50-100% daily WC, he would be at a higher risk of disease or slowed growth. Correct me if I'm wrong Don.

D'OH!!! You're right of course. I mis-read it.
Thanks for clearing that up for me.

Kacey

[judy]

Oh, it's not me, Seecher, (humble shrug) it's those little dwarf loaches of mine-- they do a heckuva job on keeping leftover food from going to waste... and they don't move quick enough to discourage the discus from their leisurely browsing, which they do love to do...
they're great discus tankmates and I can't believe the price differences if you hunt around, I got mone for $15 apiece-- my local chain LFS is selling them for $58 bucks APIECE! For a fish that won't bust two inches long at its hugest!

[Discus Dreaming]

Hi,

I'm new to discus, and the SD site. Love the site. Thanks for sharing great info.

I'm not sure that I saw a specific response to a specific question that OP asked. Does a discus reach an age when they really won't grow anymore? If it was answered, my apologies.

Thanks.

[YSS]

Just bought 3 juvies (2.5 ~3") on Tuesday for my 90G to go with 6 adults. Planted, sand and gravel substate, and whole bunch of other fish. Now, I feel like I have enough experience to do a better job growing these guys out, so we will see. I plan on feeding them 4 to 5 times a day or as many times as my schedule will allow. I am planning on continueing with my ~ 30% water change every other day. Not concerned about vacumming the uneaten food because of my other fish do a pretty good job eating everything. The new guys have already settled in well swimming around, checking everyone out, and eating. :)