Got 10 new discus and lot more questions!

[lazyreefer]

Hey guys,

I went ahead and got a 55G with 3 sponge filters (the largest hydro sponge)/bare bottom and bought 10 discus. The size range for the discus are 2-4".

I did not cycle the tank but I am doing 50% water change every day. Even with the water change the water looks cloudy.

The discus are eating very well but they are very skittish. I feed about 6-7 times a day 4 time tetra color bits(auto feeder) and 2 X FBW or frozen brine shrimp. The water temp is 85, and the PH is at 6.5. Also majority of the discus looks like they have hole in head disease.


So here are my questions,

1. Should I do a larger water change every day (75%)? - will this clear up the cloudy water? Right now I age tap water for a day on a rubbermaid container with a powerhead/heater and use de-dechlorinator 10 min before water change.

2. For the hole in head disease what medication should I use? I went and got a little crazy and bought a lot of medication (Erthromycin gel, Methylene blue, Prazi-Q, Fenbendazole, M. green, metronidazole) would treating with metro do the trick?

3. Anything else I should add to their diet? I am thinking of adding beef heart mix to my daily feeding schedule and thoughts on this (prob feed this right before the water change)?

4. I had the discus now for 3 days, how long will it take before they stop being so skittish? some times when I walk past by the tank or stand close top it, the discus swim like crazy and almost jump out of the tank!

5. Also there seems to be 1 bully of the bunch, is there any way to reduce his aggression?

6. I have not seen any white striggy poo yet, seem like most of the poo are reddish/brown, Do I need to deworm?

7. I also went and got a aqua clear 110, for 55G. I want to take maybe 2 of the sponge filter out. Should i do this or just leave it all in there?

Thanks for all your help! I will try to post some pictures later

[dwilder]

the main thing to worry about right now is not having a cycled filter,i would do 100% water change daily no beef heart yet feed small amounts so there is none left over and there are a couple of products that some people on the forum recommend to speed up the cycle i would probably look into using one

[Don Trinko]

You should have cycled the tank. Since you didn't you will need to remove the amonia the fish will produce. You can test for amonia every day and the instant it apears add chemicals to remove it (amaquel+ is one possability) or do a large WC ( water change) daily. I'm just guessing but I think 50% would be the minimum. Make sure the wc water is the tank temperature and no clorine/cloramine.
Then as the tank begins to cycle ( 2 to 3 weeks) you will see nitrites. You can add ordinary salt to prevent nitrite poisoning. ( 1 teaspoon to 1 table spoon per 10g of water) Once you see nitrites the amonia should take care of itself. Next look for nitrates. Once you see nitrates the tank should be cycled. Don T.

[lazyreefer]

I thought that if I do 50% water change every day it should be ok but I guess not :(

I will do larger water change everyday

[Don Trinko]

You need to test for amonia. You should KNOW that there is none. Even small amounts of amonia will change the fishes brehavier. If you do not have a test kit get one and get the liquid type.
Why do you think they have hole in the head? Don T.

[White Worm]

The cloudy water will continue until your media has established and your tank has completely cycled. That is a bacterial bloom which from the sounds of it, you have some fish putting out some serious waste products plus all the food you are feeding. Large water changes wont hurt your cycle (you should be doing 50% minimum daily) but you need to keep them up so the discus arent swimming in ammonia or nitrites. you need test kits for ammonia, nitrites and nitrates. As soon as you go from ammonia peak, then nitrite peak, you will see nitrates and then you are there. you can then bacl off on the large water changes a little.

[White Worm]

Hey guys,

I went ahead and got a 55G with 3 sponge filters (the largest hydro sponge)/bare bottom and bought 10 discus. The size range for the discus are 2-4".

I did not cycle the tank but I am doing 50% water change every day. Even with the water change the water looks cloudy.

The discus are eating very well but they are very skittish. I feed about 6-7 times a day 4 time tetra color bits(auto feeder) and 2 X FBW or frozen brine shrimp. The water temp is 85, and the PH is at 6.5. Also majority of the discus looks like they have hole in head disease.


So here are my questions,

1. Should I do a larger water change every day (75%)? - will this clear up the cloudy water? Right now I age tap water for a day on a rubbermaid container with a powerhead/heater and use de-dechlorinator 10 min before water change. Yes, 75% would be good and no it will not clear the cloudy water.
2. For the hole in head disease what medication should I use? I went and got a little crazy and bought a lot of medication (Erthromycin gel, Methylene blue, Prazi-Q, Fenbendazole, M. green, metronidazole) would treating with metro do the trick?
I would just up the w/c % and see what happens.

3. Anything else I should add to their diet? I am thinking of adding beef heart mix to my daily feeding schedule and thoughts on this (prob feed this right before the water change)? No more new foods especially dirty food like beefheart. Lets get the cycle complete first.

4. I had the discus now for 3 days, how long will it take before they stop being so skittish? some times when I walk past by the tank or stand close top it, the discus swim like crazy and almost jump out of the tank!
When the cycle is completed and they get settled into their new surroundings. Dont wear dark colored clothing.

5. Also there seems to be 1 bully of the bunch, is there any way to reduce his aggression?
Not really, as long as there is no damage, its normal cichlid behavior. if you have one that is injuring others, you may have to remove it.
6. I have not seen any white striggy poo yet, seem like most of the poo are reddish/brown, Do I need to deworm? Dark colored waste is normal. i would stay away from meds unless you NEED them.

7. I also went and got a aqua clear 110, for 55G. I want to take maybe 2 of the sponge filter out. Should i do this or just leave it all in there?
Its never a bad idea to have extra filtration and you could use it all at this point.
Thanks for all your help! I will try to post some pictures later
Hope that helps.

[lazyreefer]

You need to test for amonia. You should KNOW that there is none. Even small amounts of amonia will change the fishes brehavier. If you do not have a test kit get one and get the liquid type.
Why do you think they have hole in the head? Don T.

I have the tests kits so i will be testing them. I Thought with the larger water changes, it would be OK.

I think they have ahole in the head becase when I look closely at thier forehead area there are holes there. I will try to take a pic tonight.

Thanks

[ShinShin]

Get an ammonia, nitrite, and nitrate test kit. Monitor your water carefully. 10 juvie discus and a 55gal uncycled tank was not a good move. You need to feed these fish well now for proper growth, so skimping on the food is not a very good option. Your test kits will tell you when and how much to change. My guess is that 2 changes daily of 50% will not give you zero ammonia and nitrite readings. The skittishness probabally has alot to do with high nitrites.

Mat

[pcsb23]

I agree with Mat. See if you can get some Seachem Stability, I've tried this stuff and it does seem to work.

[happygirl65]

Like others said water changes are your best friend right now. When I got my first discus they were sick and I had to QT them in an uncycled tank for hospital purposes.

I ended up doing about 75% wc twice a day. The more I did that, they happier they became and eventually their fins healed up and they got better. (I did also use meds for bacterial infections, but your med will depend on what your own symptoms)

If your fish are eating that many times a day they are probably producing a lot of waste, I would back it off to just 3-4 times per day while you are cycling and even less if you can only do your water change once in a day.

Some of the holes you see may be ammonia burns but of course a pic would be better for the experts to help you identify.

You should also be aware that any meds you use could stall your cycle as many of them will kill off the beneficial bacteria. That is a really good reason to try just the salt, and large volume of water changes at first along with reduced feedings of clean foods.

Good luck. With loads of patience and attention to your new discus I am sure you will have a great outcome. :) I tend to learn things the hard way myself.

Some other ways to help speed up your cycle is to get some plants even just some stem plants left floating on the top could help a lot as they are covered in beneficial bacteria and actually soak up ammonia. Some good ones would be hornwort and/or wisteria. You don't have to keep them long term or anything but they can help you get through the first critical weeks of cycling. :)

[dwilder]

discus sometimes have tiny holes in thier head that isn't hole inthe head just keep an eye on them and if they dont get worse it might be nothing

[lazyreefer]

thanks for the reply guys. So i got home and it seems like the discus's health is going down the drain :(

They have this white stuff on their body and also one of the discus has something on both of his eyes, one eye is more swollen then the oher also. looks almost like fungus but its not cottony, more thicker, almost like white booger...

here are some pics can you guys tell me what I should do now? I did a 50% water change and also i had a spare eheim 2213 so i loaded it up with bio filter media from my eheim 2217 on my 75 gallon tank (been running for 1 month with fish) and started to run it. 2 hours after the water change I am getting 0 ammonia and 0 nitrite. I will do another test in the morning and also another 50% water change.

http://i30.tinypic.com/2lbl69y.jpg


http://i29.tinypic.com/fenouf.jpg

http://i28.tinypic.com/11jp0tg.jpg

[lazyreefer]

update

checked the ammonia this morning and it was around .25. I did a 50% water change and then added a whisper 5 filter with purigen as well as more biological filter media.

all the Discus are huddling around 1 corner and breathing kind of heavy. Also they have what looks like tail rot/fungus on their fins.. out of the 10, 8 are eating FBW.

Should I treat with anti fungus medication???

man I should have used the ammonia cycle method. I even have a gallon of it. I read somewhere/thought that 50% water change a day was good enough.. stupid me..

THanks guys

[dwilder]

its possible that what apears to be fin rot could be ammonia burns

[Apistomaster]

Maybe you should feed your new discus live black worms while waiting for your filters to become established. The worms will stay alive until they are eaten and thus contribute less ammonia than prepared foods in the transition. 75% water changes every day is not out of line since you decided to do this the hard way. Is there no other filter from another tank you could use some of the media to facilitate a more speedy break in?

[lazyreefer]

Maybe you should feed your new discus live black worms while waiting for your filters to become established. The worms will stay alive until they are eaten and thus contribute less ammonia than prepared foods in the transition. 75% water changes every day is not out of line since you decided to do this the hard way. Is there no other filter from another tank you could use some of the media to facilitate a more speedy break in?

I added a eheim 2213 with all of its bio media from 2217 from a established tank yesterday. Hopefully that will speed things up. IN the mean time seems like i have a bacterial problem to tend to as well :(

[ShinShin]

The Prime label states that double dosing won't hurt anything and 5 times the recommended dosage can be used in an emergency situation.

You probabally have bacterial infections as a result of the ammonia burns complicating your challenge. Here is where I found that Melafix has its place. Treating conventionally may also kill the very bacteria you need to be producing in your biological filter. Melafix does not impact biologocal filtration to any measurable degree. I have tested this statement. I also have seen god results using this product in my tanks as well as tanks at a friends LFS. If you don't want to use Melafix, try a formalin/malachite green product. I would, anyway.

I respectfully disagree with Apisto's recommendation on feeding CBW's for a couple of reasons. One, I wouldn't feed CBW's for any reason, and two, the reasoning does not add up to me. Feeding pellets or frozen bloodworms would be more effective to me. Feed plenty, but not enough to have any left over after feeding. More, smaller feedings may be needed, feeding the same amount in the end, so your fish get the proper amount of nutrition. Keep the bottom free of fish waste as well. Adding the other filter ought to really help out as long as it was cycled. Simply adding just another filter will not decrease cycle time.

Mat

[lazyreefer]

The Prime label states that double dosing won't hurt anything and 5 times the recommended dosage can be used in an emergency situation.

You probabally have bacterial infections as a result of the ammonia burns complicating your challenge. Here is where I found that Melafix has its place. Treating conventionally may also kill the very bacteria you need to be producing in your biological filter. Melafix does not impact biologocal filtration to any measurable degree. I have tested this statement. I also have seen god results using this product in my tanks as well as tanks at a friends LFS. If you don't want to use Melafix, try a formalin/malachite green product. I would, anyway.

I respectfully disagree with Apisto's recommendation on feeding CBW's for a couple of reasons. One, I wouldn't feed CBW's for any reason, and two, the reasoning does not add up to me. Feeding pellets or frozen bloodworms would be more effective to me. Feed plenty, but not enough to have any left over after feeding. More, smaller feedings may be needed, feeding the same amount in the end, so your fish get the proper amount of nutrition. Keep the bottom free of fish waste as well. Adding the other filter ought to really help out as long as it was cycled. Simply adding just another filter will not decrease cycle time.

Mat

Thanks for the response. I am doing 2 50% water change daily and also I have started a Maracyn and Maracyn 2 combo treatment. I will carry out the treatment as per manufactures instructions and see if it helps any. I will try melafix afterwards.

[lazyreefer]

With the medication and daily 2 X 50% water changes the discus are looking much much better. I have one discus though that is not eating. it is breathing fast and seems like its left gill plate area some of its skin fell off (i am seeing some bone). I am treating the tank for bacteria can this be something else?

I added an aquaclear 110 and also I add cloram-x to the tank between water changes. anything else i should be doing?

Thanks

[Apistomaster]

How did you acclimate your new discus from the shipping bags? I ask because if you adjusted the discus in the shipping water gradually to your aquarium water, it is often at this point ammonia trauma may occur. Most who handle quantities of shipped fish adjust for temperature equalization then, "plop and drop." Shipping water is usually high CO2. CO2 has anesthetic properties plus CO2 dissolves in the shipping bags to form carbonic acid which lowers the pH. Ammonium is much less harmful which is the form ammonia takes when the pH is less than 7.0. If you open the bags and take time to attempt to adjust the discus to your water, dissolved CO2 will "blow off" and will cause a rise of the pH to above 7.0 and at that pH the ammonium will revert to ammonia as the pH rises. It at this time that many fish experience ammonia trauma. It is widely recognized by more experienced shippers that this is best avoided hence advocating the extradited removal the fish from shipping water is good practice.
I have a feeling that you used a slow drip or similar method to attempt to acclimate your new discus and the ammonia caused trauma was preventable.

Some fear Black worms as potential vectors of disease but the vast experience is that this is not true. New discus often are slow to begin eating, especially if they experience trauma from shipping.
Black worms, lightly fed, often induce feeding earlier and used in small amounts, they do not contribute to a decline in water quality as will any uneaten prepared foods.

There are roughly two camps of discus keepers; those who use black worms and those who don't. Each have reasons that make sense to them but not to their opposite camp.
I used to collect and distribute live Tubifex worms here in the PNW and then later began using black worms. I have yet to experience any food worm related problems in four decades. Obviously, I feel comfortable using them. Any fresh water live food is useful as a first food for new discus because live foods stimulate the feeding reflex and if they remain alive before being eaten, the chance of polluting the quarantine tank is lower.

Fortunately, Discus are actually quite resilient fish and most recover from short term adverse experiences.

[lazyreefer]

How did you acclimate your new discus from the shipping bags? I ask because if you adjusted the discus in the shipping water gradually to your aquarium water, it is often at this point ammonia trauma may occur. Most who handle quantities of shipped fish adjust for temperature equalization then, "plop and drop." Shipping water is usually high CO2. CO2 has anesthetic properties plus CO2 dissolves in the shipping bags to form carbonic acid which lowers the pH. Ammonium is much less harmful which is the form ammonia takes when the pH is less than 7.0. If you open the bags and take time to attempt to adjust the discus to your water, dissolved CO2 will "blow off" and will cause a rise of the pH to above 7.0 and at that pH the ammonium will revert to ammonia as the pH rises. It at this time that many fish experience ammonia trauma. It is widely recognized by more experienced shippers that this is best avoided hence advocating the extradited removal the fish from shipping water is good practice.
I have a feeling that you used a slow drip or similar method to attempt to acclimate your new discus and the ammonia caused trauma was preventable.

Some fear Black worms as potential vectors of disease but the vast experience is that this is not true. New discus often are slow to begin eating, especially if they experience trauma from shipping.
Black worms, lightly fed, often induce feeding earlier and used in small amounts, they do not contribute to a decline in water quality as will any uneaten prepared foods.

There are roughly two camps of discus keepers; those who use black worms and those who don't. Each have reasons that make sense to them but not to their opposite camp.
I used to collect and distribute live Tubifex worms here in the PNW and then later began using black worms. I have yet to experience any food worm related problems in four decades. Obviously, I feel comfortable using them. Any fresh water live food is useful as a first food for new discus because live foods stimulate the feeding reflex and if they remain alive before being eaten, the chance of polluting the quarantine tank is lower.

Fortunately, Discus are actually quite resilient fish and most recover from short term adverse experiences.

I bought the discus locally. they were in the bag for maybe 30 minutes tops and they were acclimated for temp and then 1/5 water from the bag was replaced from the tank water every 10 min. The discus were eating tetra bits 30 mins later in the tank. I believe it was ammonia build up over night that prob. get these guys sick. Seem like they are pulling through. They are still eating a lot. Its just that hey get so spooked and huddle around one corner of the tank when anyone comes near or close to the tank and looks all stressed out.

As of now bacterial infections seems to have reversed course and I am not seeing those white boogery looking things anymore. I will still carry out the treatment for full recommended time. These medications are costing arm and a leg :(

[happygirl65]

So sorry to hear it is costing you so much $$ to treat them but I think you are right to continue your present course.

The huddling when anyone comes near is really normal. I have had some for a month and they still do that. It can take a while for them to settle in and realize you are the one who brings their food. :)

I think you are doing a great, keep it up it will be worth it in the long run. :)

[samoyedsrule]

The cloudiness is because the tank has not been cycled. once the cycleing process has had a chance to do its think, that will go away.

[t_j]

One you rushed into this WAY to fast. When it comes to discus it's all about water quality and if you don't have a cycled tank with ten discus your already starting off on the wrong foot. It's hard to see but it looks like ammonia burn the best thing for that is to add salt and you really need to do more then 50% water changes a day. Is there any one near you that you could get a cycled discus sponge from?? Maybe a local breeder or member from here??

Sorry didn't see there was a second page then you know all about the ammonia burns.

[steve.ryall]

The fish look as if they are all stunted to me :( 'Fools rush in' as they say.
Should have done more homework. ;)

[Boomer]

I agree you did rush in, however, we all learn some way or another. Now is the time to start catching up on the research area of keeping Discus. Read everything you can and when that has caused you to ask more...it means you are on the right track. It is hard to pass by Discus in LFS because they are there, and easy to get. However, when you compare them to what you get from a place like our Sponsors here, you can see the differance in quality itself. We have a LFS that sells Discus on a very regular basis as they are as common in the store as the Koi they sell. However, their shape is more football than anything, and those with good colours....are really too small to show off so nicely.

As for stunting and future growth...not sure if that matters to you. I guess it depends on what you wanted to get out of keeping Discus: beautiful fish to watch, or fish in a tank.

Anyways, the biggest lesson is that rushing in can cause you to loose more than you planned to start with.

Good luck.

[casper7]

I agree you did rush in, however, we all learn some way or another. Now is the time to start catching up on the research area of keeping Discus. Read everything you can and when that has caused you to ask more...it means you are on the right track. It is hard to pass by Discus in LFS because they are there, and easy to get. However, when you compare them to what you get from a place like our Sponsors here, you can see the differance in quality itself. We have a LFS that sells Discus on a very regular basis as they are as common in the store as the Koi they sell. However, their shape is more football than anything, and those with good colours....are really too small to show off so nicely.

As for stunting and future growth...not sure if that matters to you. I guess it depends on what you wanted to get out of keeping Discus: beautiful fish to watch, or fish in a tank.

Anyways, the biggest lesson is that rushing in can cause you to loose more than you planned to start with.

Good luck.

Yes we all learn one way or another, but in this day and age there are better ways than this example.

You have far too many discus for a 55g so if they do all recover, you need to start to think about a bigger tank, 10 gallons per discus is the rule.:argue:

Best thing you can do is keep the 55g as a QT and get a 100g tank, plus get some used filter material from your LFS and put that into a canister filter so at least the filter will have a kick start, keep up the large water changes and read up, books that maybe OK are The Guide to Owning Discus by Mary E Sweeney and thomas A Giovanetti and Oliver Lucanus "Discus Fish" (Better of the two).

Good luck

[aquagal]

How about cutting Lazyreefer some slack...

He needs help, not criticism on what he did wrong.

I bought 6 juvenilles from a sponsor of this site, did everything right in terms of QT and they still got sick. I'm still struggling, 3 months later, to get these fish healthy (and they probably never will be). QT is important, as is proper stocking. However, stuff can still happen and trying to figure it out and solve it can be overwhelming.

I hope you are making head way in getting your fish healthy!

Sherry

[lazyreefer]

Well thanks for all the comments.

I do have another 75 that is currently a planted tank that 6 of these discus will be moving to when they grow larger. They are in the 55 gallon as a grow out. I am doing 2 X 50% water change per day now on 55G with medication and seems like everything is very good. All the discus seems to have recovered. They are eating very well but they still are very skittish when I walk around the tank though. any thoughts on how I can get them to relax?

Also I did lots of research on the discus before I bought them. I just thought that 50% water change per day was enough to handle the waste from discus (wrong as I found out the hard way).

I did get the discus from a reputable dealer. I believe the hatchery where they imported the discus used to be a sponsor here ( not too sure of this). Also some of the members from this board has recommended this LFS.

I am not experienced enough to say if they look stunted or not but If I post some pictures later can you tell me how they look?

Well thanks for all the advice/comments but not too keen on people calling me a fool....

[Boomer]

I think that some people forget that these boards are here to help all of us learn. There is not one person on here that has made some sort of "bad" mistake in our learning process.

We all need to remember that the more finger pointing downwards, can lead to those who are here to learn to not a) want to come back, and b)not ask for help when the need it

[Don Trinko]

Lazyreefer?? If you are doing 2 50% wc a day you are not lazy!! I would suggest a name change. Don T.

[aquagal]

I really think the skittishness will pass (although maybe not totally). I have six juvenilles I got from Cary w/ Great Lakes Discus back in November. They really are just now starting to be less skittish.

If you comb through this forum, you'll see a lot of people have asked about skittishness (myself included). Lots of advice from making sure there are not alot of shadows, to avoiding dark/black clothing, to having the tank at the correct height to using Purigen in the filter. My personal opinion is that adult discus are just more mellow and so it may just take some time. I thought mine would never calm down and they are great now.

Sherry

[lazyreefer]

Lazyreefer?? If you are doing 2 50% wc a day you are not lazy!! I would suggest a name change. Don T.

haha :)

I never woke up before 7:50 AM before but now I wake up at 6 AM to do the water change. My wife thinks I am nuts.. but now I can follow up on my new years resolution to go joggin in the morning before work :D

[casper7]

I think that some people forget that these boards are here to help all of us learn. There is not one person on here that has made some sort of "bad" mistake in our learning process.

We all need to remember that the more finger pointing downwards, can lead to those who are here to learn to not a) want to come back, and b)not ask for help when the need it

Another good idea is to search these forums, as I would say this mistake has happened to others, and searching is a good way to learn from others mistakes. Not sure on the policy of posting links to other Discus forums, so I won't, but there are some very good european sites also that will help with regard to searching.

Good Luck;)

[NCR]

Hi there,

Just made the same mistake. I have 10 discus in an uncycled 100G tank. I'm doing 2 (or 3 whenever possible) WCs a day of 75% for two weeks now. I could use media from other filters, but I'm afraid of introducing some kind of pathogen. The discus dont show any signs of distress or disease and started eating the day they arrived. After a week they were already eating in my hand...
I do have a large driftwood in the tank that allows them to hide and I believe it makes them more confortable. I've also used salt for a week and a half.

[digthemlows]

how are they reefer?

[Peachtree Discus]

...get some Seachem Stability....
7 days and you're set.

i think a lot of people buy the fish before they thoroughly research. i did it with my daschund and my discus. learn from your mistakes and move on

[lazyreefer]

how are they reefer?
Hey thanks for asking! The discus are all doing great!! they have recovered very well and eating like pigs. They are still very skittish though. sometimes they try to swim away really fast and seems to scratch them selves on the foam cover for my aqua clears.. other then that they all seem very healthy and fat.

[bearcat]

sounds like you are doing all the right things to get you fish back to good health, sometimes it can be a hard road but stick with it ,the reward is worth all the time and hard work.
I have found that to help your fish calm down ,do not wear dark clothing when working near the tank,no quick movements around the tank, if you are feeding fbw and fbs use the cubes and feed them by hand at every feeding,and when doing water changes get your hands rate into the tank and slowly work around in there so they get to know you.
Don't baby them and sneak around so that you don't scare them, keep doing what your doing ,lots of movement around the tank just no sudden movements.
I hope this helps.

Rick

[mikel]

some Bio-Spiora (follow the direction closely) and give your nitrogen cycle a boost with the introduction of these live bacteria? I am new to discus but I have found in just one year that you might make an initial mistake, but using meds and then playing with CO2 etc etc etc will simply complicate your situation until everything is dead or long past salvaging. I would make sure I have plenty of Prime for your barebottom tank, use it for water changes, and get some Bio-Spira and pour it directly into the tank and your filter cahmbers. The Bio-Spira is suppose to work within one or two days.....it has worked with me beautifully.

Keep conditioning and changing the water in the mean time, feed sparingly for the first two weeks, keep the light low, stop fussing over them after you pour in the bio-spira and let the fish settle down without further stressing them with med ec etc etc. keep up the water change but dont overdo it. Love can kill as well as ignorance...JMHO. Best of luck to you. mike