does this look ok?

[nedecky]

Please take a look at this video (and pardon the quality):

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vKnz78zQ6sQ

Does the breathing look normal? I see some gill filaments behind the plates, and am wondering if too much is showing. Also, how is that breathing rate -- normal, too fast?

Temp 85F, plenty of air, water test: all parameters normal.

Thank you.

[DiscusDude85]

In my book from Jack Wattley he says normal respiration rate of an discus should be 60 breaths per minute,give or take a few. If they are breathing harder than that it could be flukes, Bacterial infection etc and so on.



Joe

[Graham]

Those fish are all breathing way too fast. The gill plates are being held open to a degree and they are pumping.

This could be from water chemistry, O2 levels or CO2 levels along with any one of a number of different health problems

[nedecky]

This is what I thought.

The water parameters are fine. So what should I try? I want to treat them in the main tank, since they all show signs of it. This is a planted tank.

Are either fluke tabs or f&mg ok for planted tanks? What is the brand name under which the latter is sold?

Thanks very much.

[Graham]

before you go dumping chem in there lets see if we can figure out what's causing the problem............any new fish or plants...what are the exact water parameter numbers, pH, ammonia, nitrite, KH, O2 if possible....is this system CO2 injected...anything that you can think of

[shanek]

Do you use pressurized CO2 in your planted tank? If you do, how high is your CO2?

[nedecky]

Hi Graham,

thanks for writing.

OK: here is the system:

90 gallons
16 cardinals
8 shrimp
1 clown loach
All of those fish were purchased in about December, with no new additions except for:
6 discus, purchased in April from Upper Canada Discus (Bob Garside), bred in Asia by Forrest.

Plants, gravel substrate, no CO2 system
Eheim canister filter, sponge filter with airstone, Temp 85F

The discus were successfully treated for Hex (white feces) two weeks ago. Their appetites are excellent. Some flashing, turning dark. No gasping at the top ever witnessed.

Water changes: 25% every other day, tap water.

Nitrite: 30ppm (just before water change)
Nitrate: <0.5ppm
pH: 7
KH: 150
GH: 80

I know the first and last two numbers are high. How would you work on taking these down? (I've been advised not to mess with KH and GH by someone who is a firm believer in keeping discus in tap water.)

Thanks very much.

[pcsb23]

Nitrite: 30ppm (just before water change)
Nitrate: <0.5ppm
I am hoping that you have these two the wrong way round, if there was a nitrIte (NO2) of 30ppm the fish would be dead by now!!

Given that the actual NO2 level is around the 0.5 then imo that is the root cause, this should be 0. Water changes, tank wipe downs will resolve over time, I would avoid using meds like F&MG just now as they will adversely affect the bio filter and increase the NO2 reading. Salt will mitigate the effects of NO2 but at these levels increased w/c should be al, that is needed.

[nedecky]

Ha! Yes, of course, I have the nitrAte, and nitrIte levels switched in my first post.

After the water change, the levels look a little lower -- very hard to get an accurate reading on these strips, I must say! The breathing seems slightly slowed down. Still, it does not look normal.

I increased the air flow, and angled my filter output so that it creates a bit more surface agitation in hopes of increasing the O2 level.

Any further suggestions?

Thanks again.

[BSW]

Oh Holy Moly !
Yeah they are breathing to fast !!!!
I'd myself go, prazi and formalin ! (separate of course)
If you have adequate aeration and no c02 ?
Just my HO
BSW

[nedecky]

Thanks BSW. Any others out there agree that a good choice would be to start with Prazi, then do the Formalin (I assume only if still needed)?

What dosage of Prazi is best?

Thanks.

[namasgt]

i would go with prazi pro first, the dosage on the bottle says 1 teaspoon per 20 gallon. you should see it go into efect when your air stone bubles get tiny and buble more. i think in 24 hrs they should improve.

[Graham]

Since we really don't know what this is, I'd use the F&MG 1st...it's a shot gun med. It would take one pile of flukes to have a fish that heavy and with that many you might see secondary bacterial infections

So IMO F&MG 1st, Prazi 2nd

Also strips are notoriously in accurate...get soem liquid drop test kits...what's the ammonia BTW and as paul stated the NO2 should be 0.0ppm

[nedecky]

It would take one pile of flukes to have a fish that heavy and with that many

Just wondering what exactly you mean with this phrase. Thanks.

[Graham]

ooops left a word out

It would take one pile of flukes to have a fish breathing that heavy and with that many you

[nedecky]

ok, thanks, Graham. That's what I thought you meant.