Thinking of Going Bare Bottom

[Stormy]

Hi all, I have been doing high light, C02 injected planted tanks for awhile now, had it pretty much dailed in to a razor's edge, I could grow anything to very high quality. I have a very good understanding of dosing and fert levels. Everything was beautiful and pristene.

Until I added Discus to my planted tanks.

I'm having a difficult time now keeping the plants looking good, and am getting lots of ugly, long hair algea growing on the substrate and on plant leaves. Clean it off it just comes back.

I think the amount of water changes messes up the fert levels, I used to do 1x 50% water change a week, now I do 3 x 50% a week. Also, the amount and types of food introduced to the tank, especially BH are surely messing with the water quality. The high temps needed for Discus aren't helping either.The Discus are very happy and healthy, the plants not so much anymore. They are doing ok, ok is just not good enough. I've even added lots of new species that are higher temp tolerant, still not great growth.

I'm thinking of chucking the plants and going bare bottom, though I really don't like the look of bare bottom tanks. Plus, I believe the plants add allot of natural filtration and are a usefull buffer to any tanks water quality.

What do you guys think, keep the plants or chuck them? How the heck do you grow very nice plants and very nice Discus? I'm thinking one or the other will suffer no matter what I do. The Discus are of course the number 1 priority. Thanks for reading my rant!

[White Worm]

Hi all, I have been doing high light, C02 injected planted tanks for awhile now, had it pretty much dailed in to a razor's edge, I could grow anything to very high quality. I have a very good understanding of dosing and fert levels. Everything was beautiful and pristene.

Until I added Discus to my planted tanks.

I'm having a difficult time now keeping the plants looking good, and am getting lots of ugly, long hair algea growing on the substrate and on plant leaves. Clean it off it just comes back.

I think the amount of water changes messes up the fert levels, I used to do 1x 50% water change a week, now I do 3 x 50% a week. Also, the amount and types of food introduced to the tank, especially BH are surely messing with the water quality. The high temps needed for Discus aren't helping either.The Discus are very happy and healthy, the plants not so much anymore. They are doing ok, ok is just not good enough. I've even added lots of new species that are higher temp tolerant, still not great growth.

I'm thinking of chucking the plants and going bare bottom, though I really don't like the look of bare bottom tanks. Plus, I believe the plants add allot of natural filtration and are a usefull buffer to any tanks water quality.

What do you guys think, keep the plants or chuck them? How the heck do you grow very nice plants and very nice Discus? I'm thinking one or the other will suffer no matter what I do. The Discus are of course the number 1 priority. Thanks for reading my rant!

You may just have to introduce different plant species that can deal with the temps or stop with the dirty foods. Adults only in a planted tank and they can eat mostly pellet foods. The water changes are probably your problem. Its very hard to keep the balance with constant water changes depending on your fert schedule and C02 introduction. The EI Method works with the 1 50% w/c a week to reset the system. I change about 80% once a week on my BB discus tank and feed 2x a day so I think my transformation to planted should be ok. Plus, adult discus will do fine at low temp around 80-82 which should be ok for plants also. Discus wont have as high a metabolism so you wont have to feed as much. Beefheart isnt needed. Your problems arise when you try this with juvenile discus. Thats why I have a discus tank and a planted tank. I wanted to get each science under control before I combined them, lol.

[pcsb23]

Having had both, ie planted tanks with discus and BB tanks of discus, it is a whole new learning process with planted discus tanks. It can be done, take a look at Scolleys tank, http://forum.simplydiscus.com/showthread.php?t=58151 Steve has used a lot of automation, though it's not necessary.

fwiw I found the trick was to stock lightly with discus and have an excellent clean up crew. Add in quality filtration and it means you can strike a balance between water changes/fert dosing etc.... When I was running my high tech with discus I found by doing small daily dosings of trace really helped, I dosed macros after w/c's. I did two changes a week of between 33% and 50%, but it was lightly stocked (particularly for me :o).

I've attached a pic of one of my old tanks just after a serious hair cut :) and yes it is gravel I was experimenting.

[Stormy]

Thanks for the reply, you make some very good points. I have been using the EI method of dosing ferts for awhile now with excellent results. The increase in water changes definately blows that system out of the water.

I will try cutting back the BH and try feeding cleaner foods, I have only adults in my two planted tanks so this is possible. I also have 2 bare bottom tanks with Juvies.

I'm finding it's tough to combine Discus and plants, guess it depends on your expectations. Mine are very high:)

[Stormy]

Thanks for the info Paul, beautiful tank. I'm feeling better already!

[Peachtree Discus]

...depends on the goal/point of your setup. but IMO...chuck the plants. i lost the dedication when my madagascar lace all melted away. the amount of additional work from plants/substrate + wcs etc was too much for me. plus...a recent question here on simply reminded me of the little critters that kinda turned me off 2 substrate. http://forum.simplydiscus.com/showthread.php?t=66465 I have come to enjoy the look of a bb tank with a some light ornamentation

if u stay with plants, i agree 1000% with



....have an excellent clean up crew. Add in quality filtration...

[Stormy]

Thanks for the replies, I'll give it a few more weeks applying some of the advice givin and see how it goes. :)

[Harriett]

I have had the best results in my planted discus tank by: understocking discus [usually no more than 13 adult discus in the 180g], overfiltering the tank, dosing micros and macros daily, using Flouish EXCEL in small doses daily [I add it to my fert regimen], staying mostly with crypts and swords, keeping the temp at 80-82 with lights, ferts, and CO2 at a moderate level i.e. not slamming the tank, looking for more moderate growth; I do one 70% water change weekly. I feed 2 x daily--one frozen + one pellets meal. If I have more discus in there, I cut down at bit on added Nitrate. Every tank is different.
Best regards,
Harriett

[tacks]

Hi I have had planted tanks for 12 yrs + and it has been very hard with the wilds I have in . My tank is 150 tall and I have to keep an open space, always cutting back. and way to many water changes. I dont think you can have a great planted tank and great discus. It seems you have to bend a little with both. I will say though there is no way I could have a BB tank. HYH Ed

[Crstfr]

BB tanks look like crap IMO... planted is much nicer~.... i'll get an updated pic, my plants have blown up!!!!