Waste removal without water change

[waters10]

I'm trying to come up with an easier way to clean the bottom of my BB tank that has some large driftwood pieces.

Currently I'm using a python and gravity and I remove waste, when I'm changing water. I'd like to get a more flexible system, so I can remove waste from the bottom without having to change the water and vice versa.

My idea was to get a powerhead with a filter bag on the output and a python gravel tube on the input. This would be a closed loop, so water would not get out of the tank, but waste would get traped on the filter bag. After I'm done, I'd go wash the filter bag and keep reusing it.

I did some searching, but keywords are somewhat generic. Has anyone tried this or something similar?

Other questions:
- What gph spec should I be looking for on a powerhead? Too low and it doesn't suck waste enough. Too high and I think waste would get pulverized when it hits the bag.
- What micron spec filter bag should I use? Too low and flow will suffer. Too high, waste would leak from the bag.

Thanks!!

[1077]

Always a good idea to remove waste while removing water. Can't imagine vice versa removing water but leaving poo?

[DiscusDreamer]

The Magnum 350 filter comes with such a device. It has an attachment to hook up a gravel washer to the micron filter, and works like an aquarium vacuum. Water is cycled thru the filter and you don’t have to do a water change. I would not suggest using it and believe that water changes are a lot better option. I only used it once or twice when I still had clown puke gravel, but it sounds like what you are trying to describe. There are also various products for waste removal, but I haven’t wasted any money on them. See link: http://www.drsfostersmith.com/product/prod_display.cfm?pcatid=3895

[waters10]

Always a good idea to remove waste while removing water. Can't imagine vice versa removing water but leaving poo?
Why not? I want to be able to change water with as little input as possible. So, I'm not saying that I'll reduce my water changes due to this. It's actually quite the contrary! I'm planning to remove waste on a as needed basis (once or twice a day, but a lot quicker since I wouldn't need to refill the tank and refill the ageing barrel) and change the water on a fixed basis once or twice a day, with some automation involved.

For example. In the morning, I have little time to do a full water change (takes 30-40 minutes to do everything). But I might be able to squeeze a 5-10 minute waste removal and change water later at night ...


The Magnum 350 filter comes with such a device. It has an attachment to hook up a gravel washer to the micron filter, and works like an aquarium vacuum. Water is cycled thru the filter and you don’t have to do a water change. I would not suggest using it and believe that water changes are a lot better option. I only used it once or twice when I still had clown puke gravel, but it sounds like what you are trying to describe.
Interesting. I was considering the Magnum 350 for the water polishing already, and this might be a good option. I'll look into that. thanks

[Don Trinko]

I have used a turkey baster to do this. It takes very little water out but if you have much dirt to remove it is better with a syphon.
I have made several small syphons with 1/2" pvc and air line tubing. You can remove most of the crud without removing much water. Then top off or wait for the next wc to top off. Don T.

[waters10]

I have used a turkey baster to do this. It takes very little water out but if you have much dirt to remove it is better with a syphon.
I have made several small syphons with 1/2" pvc and air line tubing. You can remove most of the crud without removing much water. Then top off or wait for the next wc to top off. Don T.
I like the turkey baster idea for some pinpoint cleaning!

Has anyone tried a product called Kleen Sweep (http://www.thatpetplace.com/pet/group/22990/product.web)? It seems to do what I want, but it connects to an air line tubing to generate suction. I could only find a couple of comments on another forum from people that used the product. I might give it a try for this price ...

[Dave27]

I have a 6 foot clear 1/2 diameter hose and a Python Squeeze Siphon Attachment and a bucket.

http://www.drsfostersmith.com/product/prod_display.cfm?c=3578+3728+18018&pcatid=18018

Takes 5 min max.
Dump the bucket then
Dip the bucket in your water storage barrel and replace water you took out.

[1077]

Were it me I would just get up earlier. Get er done!

[j_li8]

i dont see anything wrong with not topping off the water until the next water change.

[waters10]

Were it me I would just get up earlier. Get er done!
Are you calling me lazy?? :p :D

I know I'm asking for a solution for something that most don't consider a problem. This is not a deal breaker, it's just something to make life easier. And something I could use together with Scolley's auto water change, for example.

No experiences with the Kleen Sweep then?

thanks

[DiscusOnly]

If you want to recycle the water, here's what you can do based on a modified version of what I currently use.

I have 2 of my tanks below my drain line. It's about 13" off the ground so it still has enough height for gravity drain. I use a 5 gallon pale and place a quiet one pump inside to pump water up to the drain. A siphon is used to grab all the waste and it's drain to the bucket. In your case, you can simply pump the water back into the tank instead of a drain. Because you are re-using the water, you could connect a pre-filter so the the drain water is filtered.

You got me thinking.. I may try this over the weekend and this how it work out. This may cut my household water usage back to 10K gal a months.

[Peachtree Discus]

i dont see anything wrong with not topping off the water until the next water change.

i have migrated to this method for my growouts. siphon just enuf to get the crap out throughtout the day and top off after wc

[waters10]

If you want to recycle the water, here's what you can do based on a modified version of what I currently use.

I have 2 of my tanks below my drain line. It's about 13" off the ground so it still has enough height for gravity drain. I use a 5 gallon pale and place a quiet one pump inside to pump water up to the drain. A siphon is used to grab all the waste and it's drain to the bucket. In your case, you can simply pump the water back into the tank instead of a drain. Because you are re-using the water, you could connect a pre-filter so the the drain water is filtered.

You got me thinking.. I may try this over the weekend and this how it work out. This may cut my household water usage back to 10K gal a months.
Well, it's not about recycling. It's about removing waste as easy and quick as possible.

I think I'll try a combination of things. First the kleen sweep, because it's cheap enough to give it a try.

One thing I'm considering, is using a powerhead sitting on the bottom, but on one side of my tank. Maybe even use something similar to a spray bar pointed to the other side of the tank, that would sweep waste to just one area of the tank. I'd only turn it on a little bit before removing waste. I think this would help, since with my filter position (AC and sponge filter), I have waste on both sides of the tank.

As far as removing itself, I might just do what most of you suggested. Just remove the water and top it off later on.

thanks

[razputin88]

Ok, maybe this is too simple but all I do is drag an 8" fine fishnet along the bottom of the tank. The net is very fine, like the ones you use for gathering baby brine shrimp. Once you've grabbed all the crap, rinse the net under a tap; tank is clean and no water was changed. It takes all of 3 minutes to do.

[Don Trinko]

I use a net in my tanks with sand. The sand goes thru the net but most of the crud doesn't. Don T.

[waters10]

A net wouldn't work for me, due to my pieces of driftwood. I have one very large that gets to the top of the tank (22" high). Wouldn't be able to get the net around it. If my idea of using a power head + spray bar to push waste to one side of the tank works, then it might become a possibility.

[CARY_GLdiscus]

NET!

[Roxanne]

Hi, only a suggestion

I noticed alot of uneaten food and fish poop does get caught under the driftwood. If I can't move it, I create agitation with my fingers around the driftwood as close as I can get to the bottom and scoop up the crud with a net as it flies up in the water. (Gawd, here comes a thread aimed at my head...) But, IMHO I think if there was a substitute for maintenance, we'd all be doing it, leaving us more time to enjoy looking at our fish... Think about it like this if you will. If you were stuck in a lift with someone who had a gas problem, wouldn't u want the door open, or just air pumped in? Have you noticed how, in the Africa wildlife shows, when the waterholes dry up, even a puddle in the dirt with some kind of biological substrate becomes rancid, and with fish in it, yark! Throwing more water in it won't get rid of the filth. Food for thought so to speak...lol:)

[thekeem]

Wow, everyone here is so fancy. I just use a 1/4" piece of plastic tube (from Co2 kit) and let gravity do the work into a bucket. the tube is way too small for anything more than negligible amounts of water to be sucked out (and the water level ducks maybe 3mm when im done) and it takes out allll the poop and food.

I too have lots of driftwood and this is perfect because a simple flick of the tube combined with the suction will often agitate the hiding debris, easily sucking it up.

I rarely ever have to add water later, i just leave it til my next water change with no noticeable difference, only the sand is all white and clean and the fish are all happy! :)

[doc3toes]

i had a battery operated wand that i got off ebay. sucked the crap up and stored it in a little brine shrimp like baggy and dumped the water back out. Mine shorted out after a while, but it worked pretty good while i had it. I think making something larger with a power head, tube and a brine net might be even better.