Something's Brewing... Feeling Very Uneasy

[poconogal]

We leave for Florida in 2 weeks and 6 days, so of course, something is just not right...

Watching the Discus over the last few days. They're all eating like pigs, good appetites, no weight loss, they're active, no hiding, no weird behaviour at all, etc. No weird poos that I've seen in the tank or exiting :D ... but...

For awhile now I've had a few fish using one gill, but only intermittently, and until very recently, WCs have always been accomplished with little to no bubbles. I've increased WCs, I've tried "gentler" treatments with no luck, i.e., Prazi Pro, then I tried Parasite Clear. Have been trying to avoid removing 2 BNs, 1 three inch Clown Loach, 1 Cory and 6 Rummy Nose Tetras.

Now I've seen two of the Discus sort of choking, opening and closing their mouths quickly, and then spitting out little white... blobs or chunks. Not large stuff, sort of like this size ----> o or smaller.

The stuff is definitely white, not slimy or mucuosy looking either, but more like tiny bits of cooked egg white. One of the Discus looks like she has a bit of extra slime and looks maybe a tiny bit darker, from a head-on view, but she's not shedding slime. She is eating very well, with gusto, but something is amiss. This is the same Discus that I posted about getting white zits on her tail and body after WCs, which is why I decided to go back to aging and aerating my water and actually adding a bit of chlorine to it, since it's well water. This is what I used to do several years ago, when I first moved to this house.

Not sure which way to go with this, i.e. treat with Quick Cure or Life Bearer or give the 2 "choking" ones salt baths or something else, or is there a possibility of a bacterial gill problem? From a back view, gills look normal, red colored, far as I can tell, no swelling. Sorry, no scope.

Temp 84, PH 7.6, dkh 4, dgh 5. No ammonia or nitrite. Tap and tank water are almost identical. WCs - 2 to 3 a week, 50-60% each. Tank is 75 gal., 2 canisters with spray bars pointed upward, and 8-1/2 adult Discus.

Got to get this sorted before we leave!

[Ardan]

I would try a formalin and MG med.
I have used rid ich +.

Sounds like it could be a parasite/flukes problem. If you see results with the above (treat as if ich) then maybe a long term (21 day) with prazi might help.

hth
Ardan

[shawnhu]

Problem is, Connie has faced a battle with Flukes before using all the conventional methods to combat the parasite.

I think Eddie just went through a battle of his own that a combination of antibacterial meds and a Quick Cure dip helped. The concentration fo the dip was 10 drops per gallon for 30 minutes. If this is bacterial, it may not help, but if it's a parasite, it may help knock it back.

Connie,

If you do a scrape and send it to me, I can try to ID something with my scope for you. I don't know if I would be able to see anything, but it might be worth a try.

[Eddie]

Problem is, Connie has faced a battle with Flukes before using all the conventional methods to combat the parasite.

I think Eddie just went through a battle of his own that a combination of antibacterial meds and a Quick Cure dip helped. The concentration fo the dip was 10 drops per gallon for 30 minutes. If this is bacterial, it may not help, but if it's a parasite, it may help knock it back.

Connie,

If you do a scrape and send it to me, I can try to ID something with my scope for you. I don't know if I would be able to see anything, but it might be worth a try.

Hey there Shawn, just wanted to clarify. I used Formalin by itself for the dip but had initially treated the entire tank with F&MG when all 4ELL broke loose. :o

Take care,

Eddie

[brewmaster15]

Connie,
Sure does sound like a gill parasite to me as well.....Not sure what you have going on...The good news though is this has been a very slow moving infection for your fish.. so I would not panic.

I'll mention this not so much for your sake as you are not a novice...but for the novices reading.. often times people see their fish periodically flash or breath with one gill here and there...or breath a little hard and they automatically assume its all doom and gloom and the tank going crash and the discus are all going to die and thats not what those symptoms mean...they just mean somethings irritating the gills...that something could be many possibilities Its a symptom...not a diagnosis.....worse thing to do is panic...

Okay...just wanted to say that....:) Now back to Connie's fish. Connie.. I'm going say what you don't want to hear.. Lose the non-discus from the tank...IF you really want to...set them up on their own for now...I don't know if they are acting as reservoirs for parasites (its very possible) or if having them there is limiting you on what you might try if they were not...but I think its always easiest to figure out a problem if you break it down to the least variables... and when trying to deal with a Discus problem...its easier if its just discus.

Next try a comprehensive parasite treatment...The FMG is not a bad one...Formalin alone can also be used.....I tend to use FMG when there is a serious issue and formalin when its not a serious but something external I need to deal with before its a seriosu issue....galternatively...I would seriously consider salt dips to a clean tank, PP, or a shot gun like lifebearer...or clout.Normally I would not recommend these for something like this..but since you have concerns on the time and vacation...It may be time to take things more aggressively.

Hth,
al

[Chad Hughes]

Al,

Solid plan! Nice write up!

Best wishes!

[poconogal]

Al, I agree, I have to remove the non-Discus. Years ago, I never kept any other fish with my Discus for just this reason. If a Discus only tank, there are no other fish to worry about if any treatments, even high heat, need to be done. But now, with those other fish in the tank and my not wanting to harm them, it has limited me in treating the Discus.

Since I was treating with Parasite Clear, I'm letting them rest before I do anything else. There's nothing life threatening going on in the tank so I still have the luxury of time.

My gut tells me it is some gill parasite, and I think it is resistant flukes, just wanted to toss it out there just in case there was a chance they have a bacterial gill problem with them coughing up white stuff. But you know how long this has been going on, so I really don't think its a bacterial issue.

What made me a bit uneasy is the one with the slight excess slime and the white zits. The zits are gone, but the fish still has some excess slime and is still a bit darker at times. Still eating very well and active though.

Also, coughing of white stuff has stopped. No more choking or coughing going on. Since this was happening when I was treating with Parasite Clear, could be they were expelling dead flukes or the dying flukes were causing some irritation?

Thanks everyone for your responses!