Beefheart ? What is it

[aussiefish]

Hello
I have been reading a lot of the threads on the forum and see that a lot of people feed there discus BEEFHEART. The aqurium place where I got my discus recommended not feeding them this as it often gives the fish some sort of bacteria/disease (cant remember what he said it was) What is BEEFHEART and has anyone had any problems with it.

[scottthomas]

Beef heart is just what the name says: a cows heart. Many, many people feed their fish beef heart because of the the high source of protein from this meat and there is less fat I think. I have never heard that it is unsafe. I have fed it to my fish for years with no ill effect. Beef heart will grow some very big fish if used with other types of food for a varied diet. Also, my discus kill for it. Probably their favorite food other than live worms (which IMO have more risk of parasites than beef heart) My Hormel canned chili says it is made with beef heart. Wonder if my discus would like chili?:D

Scott

[aussiefish]

Thanks Scott, Where do you buy it from (supermarket or aqurium shop) also can you help with how much food I should be feeding my fish (3 large 6'' and 2 juvies 3'' plus about 20 neons) in a 75 gallon tank. I feed them 2 x frozen bloodworm cubes and 1 x sperolina cube twice a day, but they still seem hungary and follow me when i walk past the tank !!

[rickztahone]

Thanks Scott, Where do you buy it from (supermarket or aqurium shop) also can you help with how much food I should be feeding my fish (3 large 6'' and 2 juvies 3'' plus about 20 neons) in a 75 gallon tank. I feed them 2 x frozen bloodworm cubes and 1 x sperolina cube twice a day, but they still seem hungary and follow me when i walk past the tank !!

you would have to go to a supermarket to get the beefheart. when you do get the beefheart make sure you trim all the fat you possibly can. you should add other ingredients into the BH mix as well. check the nutrition section, there are plenty of recipes

[Jhhnn]

My supermarket, King Soopers (Krogers) normally doesn't have it on the shelf, but if I call the meat dept before 1:00 pm, they have it for me the next day after 9:00 AM. Properly trimmed, heart is the leanest cut of meat, iirc...

I rinse it in cold water and drain, then trim. It takes a lot of trimming to get to just red meat, and then cubing, freezing, and putting it through the salad shooter ala "Carol's beefheart", but the fish are nuts for it. As part of a varied diet, it really seems to help growing out sub-adults. Some mixes are messy in the tank- not a prob if you have smaller fish, but with sub-adults and larger, Carol's methods give nice bite-sized chunks and no mess...

Concerns wrt hormones may be valid- dunno. I suspect that organic heart (beef, buffalo, wild game) would work as well, if it's available to you... maybe kangaroo heart in australia...

[tcyiu]

The aqurium place where I got my discus recommended not feeding them this as it often gives the fish some sort of bacteria/disease (cant remember what he said it was)

A concern that has circulated in this and other discussion forums is that discus cannot process the small residual fat in the meat, so-called tallow. Discus did not evolve to eat meat from land based animals. So their bodies don't process it.

For humans, when we can't process something, it results in gas. Don't know what happens to discus. ;-)

BUT, the counter argument is that the results of very fast growth from this protein rich food, more than outweigh the negatives. So up to you to decide.

Tim

[Jhhnn]

A concern that has circulated in this and other discussion forums is that discus cannot process the small residual fat in the meat, so-called tallow. Discus did not evolve to eat meat from land based animals. So their bodies don't process it.

For humans, when we can't process something, it results in gas. Don't know what happens to discus. ;-)

BUT, the counter argument is that the results of very fast growth from this protein rich food, more than outweigh the negatives. So up to you to decide.

Tim

What happens to the tallow is nothing- if they can't digest it, then it passes right through the fish, near as I can tell, and ends up as an easily dealt with film of oil on the water. Keeps 'em regular...

[tcyiu]

The real question is: do little smelly bubbles come out of the back ends??

Just kidding.

Tim

[April]

most of the breeders who have big beautiful discus in the shows in asia were raised on beefheart. hence they are show stoppers. there must be value in it if the winning discus in asia and all the fry sold and exported were fed beefheart. if it didnt work..they wouldnt use it. you can also use tuna, or extra lean ground beef. or as someone said..roo heart or lamb. read the nutrition section. some stores selll frozen cubed beefheart..but the discus dont take to it as well.

[exv152]

I feed my discus one type of live food per day, along with color crisps, pellets and flakes on a daily basis. Live foods include turkey heart, beefheart, bloodworms, brine shrimp and occasionally moquito larvae and earth worms (chopped up) to no ill effect. But I feed my six discus two frozen cubes per day of live food plus the dry foods.

I think the key is a variety.

[Eddie]

I feed my discus one type of live food per day, along with color crisps, pellets and flakes on a daily basis. Live foods include turkey heart, beefheart, bloodworms, brine shrimp and occasionally moquito larvae and earth worms (chopped up) to no ill effect. But I feed my six discus two frozen cubes per day of live food plus the dry foods.

I think the key is a variety.

The turkey heart and beeheart is still alive? :D

[exv152]

The turkey heart and beeheart is still alive? :D

yeah, I don't mix the two, it's one or the other, but I wonder if they're not pretty much the same thing. I was told the turkey is more lean...???

[Eddie]

yeah, I don't mix the two, it's one or the other, but I wonder if they're not pretty much the same thing. I was told the turkey is more lean...???

I am not sure, I use Tuna/Salmon.....its leaner-er. :D

Eddie

[exv152]

Although I wouldn't be surprised if you took juveniles of the same age, and fed half of them dry food and other half a mixture of live & dry, they would probably grow the same. Especially considering the greatly improved nutritional value of dry food available today, as opposed to 25 years ago when beefheart was the staple of a discus diet.

[Eddie]

Although I wouldn't be surprised if you took juveniles of the same age, and fed half of them dry food and other half a mixture of live & dry, they would probably grow the same. Especially considering the greatly improved nutritional value of dry food available today, as opposed to 25 years ago when beefheart was the staple of a discus diet.

Very true, I always wanted to raise babies on just Flake. One day I am going to. ;)

Eddie

[Tito]

Oh sweat.....




.............live beefheart! Who wudda thunk of id!

[exv152]

Oh sweat.....live beefheart! Who wudda thunk of id!

You mean swEEt?

Sweat is what happens when you perspire.

[TankWatcher]

Hi Aussiefish

If you plan to make you're own beefheart mix, you will probably have to ask your butcher to order it in for you. Some Woolworths have it in their pet section, cut in cubes. I actually found that to be a bit more fiddly, as you have to be extra careful to cut off all fat & sinew & doing this from a whole heart seemed less fiddly. Either way, it is still a fiddly job though.

Apart from that, you can buy pre made beef heart mix at some LFS.

To answer your question about problems? Well so far, I've had none. My home made mix is fed daily. It is not all beef heart though. There are other goodies in there as well.

[Apistomaster]

I find after doing a thorough hand trimming and removal of all the fat, connective tissue and blood vessels if it is run through an electric meat grinder using the finest blade attachment that even more of the traces of waste material is retained by the blade.
I blend the ground heart next and incorporate the binding agent and any additives I may want.
I pack the finished product using a food sealer. The plastic is the best to prevent freezer burn. It is a hassle to make your own but you cannot buy any pre-packaged product from fish shops that is nearly as good.

It has been shown by many show winning breeders, Jack Wattley for one, that Discus raised on quality flake food grow just as well and just as large as any raised on beef heart. He writes that is all they use in their hatchery. So beef heart is not essential for raising quality Discus.

So it seems it is more a matter of personal choice whether or not you want to make your own beef heart blends. I don't make it or use it nearly as much as I used to but it does have some place in the hobby. For one, it is easy to make special purpose blends and beef heart is so readily accepted by discus that a beef heart blend can make a good delivery vehicle for making your own medicated food which will have long storage life in the deep freeze.