quick co2 question

[DavidC]

just out of curiosity what size regulator do you use? meaning 1psi 5 psi or more? from my understanding regulators go down to said psi and thats the minimum that they will out put, any advise?

[Chad Hughes]

David,

If you are going to use a dual gauge regulator, inlet pressure typically is around 4000 PSI and outlet goes up to about 15o PSI. This is for a typical medium duty regulator. You'll never see these upper limits in aquarium use though.

Hope that helps!

[yikesjason]

I have my outlet pressure set at 15 psi. That is pretty normal.

[DavidC]

So I can get a steal of a deal reg with waranty from a gas supplier but wasn't. Sure it would work though they go down to 5 psi but I wasn't sure if it was less.. For tanks.. What psi usually is 1 bubble per second? At 8 ft of tube down 18 inches... Or 24 inches as well..

[Chad Hughes]

The regulator really doesn't play a role in the BPS. The needle valve controls the BPS. I typically turn my regulator knob about half way. From memory, that puts the PSI at the needle valve at about 30 PSI. I tune the needle valve until I get a fine stream of bubbles, typically more than I can count in one second.

The only reason that I do this is that my Ph is controlled with a Ph controller, so the delivery rate is better high than low. Once the desired Ph is achieved the controller shuts the whole thing off. I have tried to use the 3 BPS thing in the past but the controller stays on constantly. Stepping the BPS up to a stream allows the controller to quickly correct the Ph and keep it there. Keep in mind that my system also employs a trickle filter, so I do gass off some CO2 causing the controller to correct for the gass off.

Hope tha thelps!

[kush]

Hard question to answer, I think. At least, I've been using pressurized CO2 for over ten years and never thought of it in those terms. I don't think I could set bubbles per second without a needle valve.

I get a used five pound tank from my local Airgas (welding supplies). When its empty I just bring it back and swap it for a full bottle. I have it set up:

Regulator > solenoid > needle valve > bubble counter

So I just open the regulator to whatever, the solenoid turns the flow on when the lights come on in the morning, and I adjust the BPS with the needle valve.

Tip: Use glycerin in your bubble counter. Its about a buck at the drugstore, as opposed to ten dollars or whatever they're charging for 'bubble counter fluid' (i.e., glycerin) these days.

[kush]

The regulator really doesn't play a role in the BPS. The needle valve controls the BPS.....

Oops! You type faster than I do!

[DavidC]

ok well what i am researching is going to AIRGAS shop and getting their regulator, and bottle... so the reg basically is either open or closed in this application has no real importance and the needle valve is what actually controls how much co2 im receiving in the tank?... now a solenoid would just be a electronic way to control the on and off with out turning the bottle open and closed every day right? im getting a 101 crash course through you guys i do appreciate this as i am sure i could have used the search but this is much better because now im getting possible new contacts which is always good ;)

[yikesjason]

It is really important to have a good needle valve. Don't get one of the cheap ones you can find at Home Depot. My recommendation is Fabco Air NV-55. It is very stable and you don't have to worry about over dosing co2 and killing your discus.

[DavidC]

hmm.. did some more research on line and i guess i rather go with a aquarium supplier for these items, he was going to charge 110 for 5lb bottle and 60 for regulator, i would then have to add solenoid and needle valve and possibly and ph controller i like those ideas, thanks again guys

[kush]

Milwaukee makes a good combination package. You can find them on eBay for about $85+, sometimes less...

http://cgi.ebay.com/MA957-CO2-Regulator-Solenoid-Bubble-Counter-MA-957_W0QQitemZ380178868771QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_Def aultDomain_0?hash=item58846d2a23#ht_3128wt_991

(The little knob to the right of the bubble counter is the needle valve).

[yikesjason]

Milwaukees are hit and miss. If you get one, you should get a better needle valve for it.

[kush]

I have two. I know what you're saying, the needle valve is definitely stiff and its real work to get it exactly where you want it, but it gets the job done.

[DavidC]

so whats the end all be all of product, which is the cadi of gmc or the Lincoln of ford/merc?... dont wanna buy and then think man i should have spent the extra 20-50$ i got time to plan for this, im in no hurry as this will be in my 200 gal tall show tank with low tech plants ( grass & anubis & other simple growers.. and moss balls)( i love the moss balls they remind me of dr suess stories as a kid)...

[kush]

The Cadillac version has a pH controller, too. Oooooooh.

I don't know, I've been using the same Milwaukee equipment for over ten years and I've been satisfied. It may not sexy but its inside the stand and I can't see it anyway and, besides, you get one of those rusty paint-spattered tanks from Airgas, it would just break your heart to put some sparkly brushed titanium Swiss-engineered equipment on it. I suspect you can pay as much as you want but sometimes more expensive isn't necessarily more better.

[DavidC]

kush,

thats right about what i wanted to hear, personally i love my tahoe that can smoke most escalades so i can settle with that.. and the tanks were brand new never charged, he just advertised saying if there is an issue they would replace and if it didnt pass "the first test" they would replace it, no questions, personally i didnt know they test co2 bottles but then again im use to oxygen tanks... that need hydrotesting.. Milwaukee sounds like the route to go but maybe just a different needle?

[kush]

.....maybe just a different needle?

Sure. As long as you're starting from scratch, might as well do it right. You should be able to get a nice needle valve for under $20.

[yikesjason]

Here (http://www.greenleafaquariums.com/complete-co2-systems/ultimate-co2-system.html) is the Cadillac of co2 systems that you can buy off the shelf. But there are nicer setups you can build from scratch.

[DavidC]

sold! no not really but i like how they even break down pictures, but then again thats what gave me the idea of making putting together my own...

[Chad Hughes]

David,

Here is a link (http://cgi.ebay.com/SMS122-pH-Controller-Milwaukee-Co2-Regulator-MA957_W0QQitemZ350277514125QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_D efaultDomain_0?hash=item518e2ab38d)to the same equipment that I use in the house. I bought them right off Ebay. Milwaukee has GREAT customer service if you ever need help. I had a controller totally quit on me (wouldn;t power up) so I contacted them. They replaced it no questions, including a brand new probe. Talk about satisfaction!

Once I had this, I went here (http://www.beveragefactory.com/draftbeer/tanks/co2/C10.shtml) to get the tank. Beverage factory is local (Mira Mesa) so you don;t have to sweat shipping on the tank. They will fill tanks as well. That's where I get my CO2. You could even go a bit cheaper with a smaller CO2 tank, but I like the 10lb.

So, final total......

For $272.40 you can have the cadillac system and not worry about your CO2 system until you need to refill the tank.

[ChloroPhil]

For $272.40 you can have the cadillac system and not worry about your CO2 system until you need to refill the tank.


Wow, that's a great price! After 11 years keeping plants and using every sort of carbon suppliment system imaginable I can say with 100% certainty that you're best off buying the very best you can at the beginning. Once systems like this get set up and honed in, they're out-of-sight-out-of-mind until the gas runs out. The durability and peace of mind is worth the initial pay out, especially when the fish are $75.00+ apiece.

Cheers,
Phil

[Chad Hughes]

;)

[Wahter]

Aquabotanic sells some regulators and needle valves too:

http://www.aquabotanicstore.com/category_s/2.htm

hope that helps,


Walter

[DavidC]

thanks for the links guys, i am just making up a Christmas list... :p

[bayboy1205]

Here is another place for cylinders http://www.aquariumplants.com/Aluminum_CO2_Cylinders_Tanks_p/t.htm
I purchased the Ultimate system from GLA and have since upgraded the output to a triple manifold. I thought about buying everything separate, but the owner of GLA is very good to work with and will give lots of help figuring out problems.