??? Freshwater Clams anyone????

[KEWX]

Does anyone have freshwater clams in their planted discus tank? I saw an ad on a plant site that says Substrate Burrower - Golden Clams are good for the substrate and plants, plus they help clean the substrate and water. Has anyone had any experience with them? Would loaches in a community tank try to eat them? Do the clams carry disease and/or parasites? Thanks

[zamboniMan]

I think larger loaches might bother them but if I were going to use them in a tank (they're in my koi pond) I wouldn't put them someplace where there are loaches.

Nor would I put them in a planted tank because they do burrow and move (they pull themselves around with their "foot")around a bit. They will filter out algae and micro organisms in the water improving overall water quality.

As for disease all I can say is the koi don't care about them. I haven't kept them in a tank so I can't say positively that they carry disease or that they don't.

They're illegal in some states so be careful.

[mmorris]

I would suspect them of carrying disease like any other living freshwater organism introduced into the tank. Can they take the temperature? I wouldn't want clams that size dieing and rotting in my substrate.

[Scribbles]

I've read that they frequently die while buried in the substrate and can foul a tank quickly since you won't know that they are rotting under the sand. I also suspect that they cound carry disease but I'm not sure.

Chris

[moik]

$2.00 clam ---$100.00 discus..I would think it is not worth the risk..It is up to you though..Always have to smirk when someone has a sick discus and look at their pictures in the Disease section and there is a $2.00 fish in the picture/tank..With all of the tank maintinance and water chages we do,why would anyone risk their discus investment on a $2.00 catfish or other common tropical fish..Each to their own..We all have our opinions and ways we do what we do..

[fishorama]

I've heard what Scribbles said, they're hard to keep & can die undiscovered. What kind of loaches? Botia types tend to eat inverts if they can. Not worth the risk IMO.

[KEWX]

THANKS for the input! CLAMS SOUND LIKE A BAD IDEA!

[bs6749]

I've had them before in a tank with some blue rams, tetras, and BN plecos but never with discus. I wouldn't either just for the reasons that others mentioned. It's not worth the risk IMO. They can be cool to have but not in a discus tank. I'll try to find a couple of pictures of the clams I had and post them tomorrow it I remember and can find the CD they are on. They looked pretty cool up close.

[KEWX]

Thanks!

[bs6749]

Well, I had a stack of CD's with photos on them and the second one I grabbed had some clams pictured. Some photos are better than others. Hope you enjoy them.

[bs6749]

And since you weren't tired of seing basically the same picture, here are some more very similar ones LOL.

[KEWX]

Neat pictures! Thanks! So, do they close up and sink down when a big fish swims by, when you pass the tank, or when you clean the gravel?

[bs6749]

When you put them in the tank you are supposed to half bury them according to the LFS owner. I stood mine up vertically and it was there for days filtering. They will close up if they sense something near or if something brushes them. If you don't disturb them they will be fine. If you dodisturb them, then they should open up in a relatively short amount of time. Never closed with me in front of the tank watching them.

[April]

i agree...if they do die..yuk..stink. and how do you know if they did die?
cool pics..i had some ..mine were bigger and pink. they were already rotten and dead when i received them. mine werent for my discus though..i was gonna sell them.

[Apistomaster]

I tried these clams but not with Discus. I did keep them in planted tanks which were as warm as most Discus tanks.
I think they should be kept between 70 and 80*F for their best welfare.
I did not find their digging to cause any problems with plants with well established root systems and I don't have a lot of concerns about clams being serious vectors of fish disease but some will die out of every group regardless of the health and temperatures of the tank. Since the few that died did so at disparate intervals they did not over tax the filter system. I also noticed their deaths so they were not left in the tank long enough to become really rotten.
I think as long as you don't use too many just one dying won't cause a lot of problems. You will notice it but remove the carcass and do a water change and things should continue to run smoothly.
I don't think Botia Loaches not more than 4 or 5 inches are likely to harm them. They may not be very vulnerable to even larger loaches but I don't have any experience with mixing clams with very large Botia species. A clam is very different from a snail when it comes to defenses but I would not use any with Discus nor use more than 6 in a tank with a base 12 X 30 inches like a 20 long or 29 High.
I would try them again. My experience with them was positive on the whole; just leave them out of your warmer water tanks. Experimenting with various fresh water invertebrates broadens your experience as an aquarist. I don't know how long these clams are supposed to live but most of mine lasted over 2 years.

[lkc]

If you really want to get the skinny on FW Clams, I would go to www.wetwebmedia.com. My first thought on the subject is that they would starve to death in a fairly short time due to the cleanliness of our tanks. Planted tanks are pretty sterile compared to the gunk you find in the substrate out in nature.

[Apistomaster]

I was able to keep 6 alive for 2 years in a planted 20 long so they had to be finding enough to eat. I did start out with a dozen and divided them between 2 20 longs. You should expect a few to die right away and those will be among the clams that do no immediately begin to burrow so those are easily removed before they contribute to making a mess of things. Then a few more died over the first few months but only one at a time and usually in only one tank so again, not much chance of fouling the water. 2 years is pretty good mileage for animals only costing a couple bucks each.
Think about how long common Rams last at about 4 X the price. Two years would be considered pretty good "mileage." The average life span of Blue and Gold Rams is little more than 2-1/2 years and they are already at least 5 months old by the time they are offered for sale.
I would reiterate that I do not think these are appropriate animals to be kept in a planted Discus tank but they do offer one a chance to expand your aquatic horizons.
Mine normally remained half to 2/3 buried in the substrate; sometimes completely buried. So I only saw them on the surface of the substrate, opened up to feed, just before they dug themselves deeper into the substrate. Maybe I had better luck because I do not obsess as much over maintaining as clean tanks as some? I plan to try some again sometime. I like keeping freshwater invertebrates; mainly shrimp but clams were something new and different to try. I think they are worth trying in a non-discus planted tank if you have some curiosity about keeping various invetetbrates. Some do well and some do not. If I didn't experiment I wouldn't learn which are well suited for my tank conditions and which were not. I haven't had much luck, long term, with the various filter feeder shrimp like the Bamboo Shrimp. Few have lived longer than 6 months for me.
I like to create as complex an ecosystem as I can in my planted tanks and most have self-sustaining Black worm colonies. Even with some Corydoras spp present the worms manage to survive. When I vacuum the substrate I am able to collect enough worms to feed to the fish again. I only keep about 4 aquariums with enough substrate to support rooted plants and the rest of my tanks have less than 1/4" layer of fine sand or FloraBase.
I don't care much for bare bottom tanks and only keep a couple of them that way.

What I would really like to try are some Anemone helena aka Assassin Snails. I have an abundant food supply for them.

I guess my main point is to try to keep an open mind and don't be afraid to experiment with different invertebrates unless they happen to be rare and prohibitively expensive specimens. And to use some common sense about which types of aquariums in which you are willing to take some risks.