seeking help: caring for the fry

[htruong]

Hi everyone,

My paired lay eggs 3 days ago on the side of the tank and now I have around 40 - 50 wigglers. It has been frustrating process and I am happy I am at this state now. I want to hear from the experts you do your WC. How many times a day? How much water do you change each day? When can I start feeding the fry with BBS? I've never made BBS in my life. What is the best device to made BBS? Any particular brand?

Thanks,
-Hoang

[kaceyo]

You can do 30% daily wc's untill the fry go free swimming. Then no wc's untill they attach to parents. Don't feed parents while not doing wc's. You'll need to read up on hatching bbs. I use an inverted 2ltr pop bottle that screws into a base you can buy at most online aquarium outlets.
Do wc's at 50% twice a day once bbs are being fed. I buy my BS eggs from Brineshrimp Direct online though you may be able to find some at a lfs.
I'd suggest that you read as much as you can about these subjects so you have a basic idea of what to expect.

Kacey

[mmorris]

Auntie Martha' kitchen sink method of bbs, post 4: :D
http://forum.simplydiscus.com/showthread.php?t=73479&highlight=kitchen+sink

I now use a turkey baster to take the bbs out (as Keith suggested).

[htruong]

Thanks Kacey and Martha.

-Hoang

[htruong]

You can do 30% daily wc's untill the fry go free swimming. Then no wc's untill they attach to parents. Don't feed parents while not doing wc's. You'll need to read up on hatching bbs. I use an inverted 2ltr pop bottle that screws into a base you can buy at most online aquarium outlets.
Do wc's at 50% twice a day once bbs are being fed. I buy my BS eggs from Brineshrimp Direct online though you may be able to find some at a lfs.
I'd suggest that you read as much as you can about these subjects so you have a basic idea of what to expect.

Kacey

Kacey,
Why no wc's until they attach to parents? You don't want the fry go in the hose and lose them??? If that is the case, I think Eddie has a pretty good idea. He sucks the water to a bucket and then hand pick the fry (if any) and place them back with the parents. Are there any other reasons?


Thanks,
-Hoang

[Eddie]

Kacey,
Why no wc's until they attach to parents? You don't want the fry go in the hose and lose them??? If that is the case, I think Eddie has a pretty good idea. He sucks the water to a bucket and then hand pick the fry (if any) and place them back with the parents. Are there any other reasons?


Thanks,
-Hoang

Hoang, the time from wriggler, free-swimming and then attachment, is a very delicate/sensitive time for the fry. Its best to keep everything exactly the same, no changes in water. This is also important for the parents as it can cause them to eat the fry, from fear or from wanting to spawn again.

Once the fry attach, then water changes are easy, with the occasional fry going for a ride down the siphon, but not too often. Some people use fine netting over the siphon tube to prevent fry from going for a ride. :D

Take care,

Eddie

[kaceyo]

Kacey,
Why no wc's until they attach to parents? You don't want the fry go in the hose and lose them??? If that is the case, I think Eddie has a pretty good idea. He sucks the water to a bucket and then hand pick the fry (if any) and place them back with the parents. Are there any other reasons?


Thanks,
-Hoang

It's mainly because you have an inexperienced pair and don't know if your messing around in the tank will cause them to eat the wrigglers/fry. I do wc's every day throughout the breeding process except for new parents. Once they become familiar with the breeding routine, you can continue to do daily wc's with most pairs. Syphoning into a bucket is a good idea too when needed.

Kacey

[merk175]

just a general question. I've been told the pair will likely have another spawn after 6 or 7 days. I assume that is about the time that the fry may go free swimming/attaching to the parents??? How do they deal with spawning and caring for new fry at the same time? Anything I should do?

[kaceyo]

just a general question. I've been told the pair will likely have another spawn after 6 or 7 days. I assume that is about the time that the fry may go free swimming/attaching to the parents??? How do they deal with spawning and caring for new fry at the same time? Anything I should do?

Yes, if they spawn again with wrigglers or freeswimmers in the tank, remove the eggs right away, and you may have to remove or seperate one of the parents. They will usually kill/eat the first spawn in favor of the second if you let them continue with the second spawn.

Kacey

[htruong]

Hoang, the time from wriggler, free-swimming and then attachment, is a very delicate/sensitive time for the fry. Its best to keep everything exactly the same, no changes in water. This is also important for the parents as it can cause them to eat the fry, from fear or from wanting to spawn again.

Once the fry attach, then water changes are easy, with the occasional fry going for a ride down the siphon, but not too often. Some people use fine netting over the siphon tube to prevent fry from going for a ride. :D

Take care,

Eddie



It's mainly because you have an inexperienced pair and don't know if your messing around in the tank will cause them to eat the wrigglers/fry. I do wc's every day throughout the breeding process except for new parents. Once they become familiar with the breeding routine, you can continue to do daily wc's with most pairs. Syphoning into a bucket is a good idea too when needed.

Kacey


You guys are great. I followed your directions. When I got back home from work, the parents moved the fry to the sponge filters. Some are with the parents, some are somewhere else. Do they know how to find the parents? At what days they attach to the parents? Also, the mom doesn't show any interested in food as she is so focus on the fry. The dad just ate all even I purposely droped in front of the mom! Is it normal? How long can she go without food? Sorry for newbie questions.

I was at this state couple of times before but never had any success. I know I have lots to learn but I feel much more comfortable now. I am glad I find out this forum. You guys have the knowledge and most of all your willingness to help.

I have som pics to share. The fry were moving so it's kind of hard to spot them. Will keep you updated on their progress.

Thank you.
-Hoang

[Eddie]

Looking good Hoang! The one thing that wasn't mentioned, is that turning down the flow of air to the filters is important. This keeps the fry from being drawn, sucked to the filter. Also, the fry will be drawn to the filter by the color. Some use white stockings/netting over the sponge to keep fry drawn to the parents.


Good luck my friend!

Eddie

[kaceyo]

Some discus do lose all interest in food while they care for their fry so don't worry about that. It can take a day or two for all the fry to attach. Hopefully all the fry will attach and all will go well, but don't be too disappointed if things don't work out this time. It's not unusual for a new pair to take a number of spawns before they get it right.
Good luck,

Kacey

[htruong]

Looking good Hoang! The one thing that wasn't mentioned, is that turning down the flow of air to the filters is important. This keeps the fry from being drawn, sucked to the filter. Also, the fry will be drawn to the filter by the color. Some use white stockings/netting over the sponge to keep fry drawn to the parents.


Good luck my friend!

Eddie


Luckily my air pump isn't that strong or the fry just strong enough to break away. Thanks buddy.




Some discus do lose all interest in food while they care for their fry so don't worry about that. It can take a day or two for all the fry to attach. Hopefully all the fry will attach and all will go well, but don't be too disappointed if things don't work out this time. It's not unusual for a new pair to take a number of spawns before they get it right.
Good luck,

Kacey

Most the fry attach now - about 3/4 of them. I think the rest aren't attached. They are on the sides and on the surface. Are there any cases some fry never attach and eventually die off?

Thanks Kacey.

-Hoang

[kaceyo]

Yes, that can happen. Since you have the majority attached now there's a good chance that the others will follow, but it could go either way. Watch them and see if you start to see a difference in size between the attached and others. If they're still the same size in a couple of days then they are going to the parents to feed sometimes.

Kacey

[htruong]

All the one that were not attached were much smaller in size and they all died. Maybe I will lower the water just a little bit obove the parents next time to increase the attachment rate (I think Mr. Eddie suggested this to someone in other thread)


I know lots of people here clean the breeding tank regularly. I want to use pleco to do the job. Pleco appears to be safe with discus. I think they can do a good job picking the left over by the fry and the parents. It is easier to remove the pleco's output. What do you think?

BTW, the fry are doing great. They are growing fast too... Attachment is the pic.

Thanks,
-Hoang

[htruong]

I had 2 dead fry last 2 days. I am doing 50% WC twice daily. Does anyone have any ideas what cause the fry death?

Thanks,
-Hoang

[mmorris]

Is the water aged and the exact same temperature and ph as the tank water? I do more than 50% twice a day.

[kaceyo]

I had 2 dead fry last 2 days. I am doing 50% WC twice daily. Does anyone have any ideas what cause the fry death?

Thanks,
-Hoang

Also, what are the symptoms that lead to the deaths? Scratching, turning dark, loss of appitite etc.

Kacey

[htruong]

Also, what are the symptoms that lead to the deaths? Scratching, turning dark, loss of appitite etc.
Kacey

They separated from the group and went to the surface before death. They were so small so I couldn't tell if they loss of appitite.



Is the water aged and the exact same temperature and ph as the tank water? I do more than 50% twice a day.
mmorris
Yes, the water aged. I will up the WC. 75% twice a day.

Thanks all.

-Hoang

[kaceyo]

Sounds like they were deprived of oxygen. Have you treated for flukes at all?
Can you tell if they are breathing rapidly?

Kacey

[htruong]

Sounds like they were deprived of oxygen. Have you treated for flukes at all?
Can you tell if they are breathing rapidly?

Kacey

I have not treated for flukes yet. What medicine do you recommend?

It's hard to tell if they are breathing rapidly but I'd guess so.

Thx.

-Hoang

[htruong]

I have prazipro available. It can treat flukes. Any advices?

Thanks,
-Hoang

[kaceyo]

You can try the PraziPro. Prazi does work on flukes. I use the pure powder form which works much better for some reason, even at the same dose. I would probably use formalin in your situation because it works quickly.

Kacey

[mmorris]

I think problems at this age are more often water quality rather than flukes. Make sure you do a thorough wipe-down of the tank and everything in it every day. I would use acriflavin first, one drop per gallon.