Pecking order or just plain bullying?

[SHAD0W]

I got my first discus two weeks ago, they are a red melon discus (size of pingpong ball) and a blue turquoise (size of a tennis ball).

Yesterday I got 2 more discus, a blue diamond (same size as melon) and a checkerboard (little bit smaller than the blue turq)

The origional pair never bothered each other and they would happilly swim around together. When the new arrivals came, the turquoise clamped his fins and hid, the melon began chasing the two new ones around for the first hour.

Today the turq is looking very brave and swimming round with all of his discus friends but periodically the melon with chase the checkerboard and diamond into hiding again. Theres not been any conflict between any of the other fish and the melon never botheres the turq?

Is this normal behavior? Is it common for the smallest discus to be the bully?

[Moon]

They are trying to establish a pecking order. When you have a group of discus or any other chiclid, one or two end up at bottom of the pecking order. Often they end up as runts.

[mjs020294]

How big is the tank, and what cover do they have. We have a lot of plants and some big pieces of driftwood in our 90g. Even when one fish does want to be a bully there are far too many hiding places for it to bother another fish.

[Jason K.]

definetly a pecking order is being established.

[SHAD0W]

How big is the tank, and what cover do they have. We have a lot of plants and some big pieces of driftwood in our 90g. Even when one fish does want to be a bully there are far too many hiding places for it to bother another fish.

same as yours, heavily planted so there's lots of hiding places and theres also a series of caves made out of rocks to hide behind.

Its not relentless fin tearing bullying, just chases them out of sight. Which is a shame cuz I'd like to see my new fish.

Will this calm down and eventually stop or will it go on forever?

So its nothing to worry about?

[mjs020294]

Its not relentless fin tearing bullying, just chases them out of sight. Which is a shame cuz I'd like to see my new fish.

Will this calm down and eventually stop or will it go on forever?

So its nothing to worry about?


Sounds like typical juvenile behavior to me, mine do the same thing. One or two of them have little "bullying" sessions, and then ten minutes later they are swimming with the group peacefully.

I think it is just normal behavior, just like puppies like to fight and establish a pecking order.

[SHAD0W]

I think it is just normal behavior, just like puppies like to fight and establish a pecking order.

If thats so then the checkerboard is certainly at the bottom of the barrel. Bit worried about him as he's not come out of his hidey corner to eat yet today (fed them 4 times) and his fins are clamped...

I think the melon and the turq are making the newbies look extra shy as they are already settled into their surroundings and are not afraid to go looking for food etc..?

[Scribbles]

They are establishing a pecking order. Discus are thugs are will beat up on each other. It may settle down or it may continue. The more discus you have the more the aggresion is spread out. Just remember to quarantine any new fish before adding them.

Chris

[DerekFF]

Sounds like pecking order to me, and also sounds like you didn't QT like we all have probably made the mistake of doing. Watch them closely for a while, the pecking order stress+no QT could lead to some sickies!

[SHAD0W]

I didnt QT because the LFS does this with all new arrivals for 6 weeks before putting them on sale and they all came from the same place.

If I QT them at home wouldnt that cause the same/more stress as they would have to move homes twice and a pecking order would still have to be established?

[DerekFF]

They may have qt'd the fish, but did they watch to see any health issues? I don't think any of my lfs's take the time like what an owner would to watch/gauge a discus' health. Not said about all fish stores, but probably most. And if you have a good quiet qt area for the fish at home it shouldn't be to bad stress wise on them.

[SHAD0W]

They may have qt'd the fish, but did they watch to see any health issues? I don't think any of my lfs's take the time like what an owner would to watch/gauge a discus' health. Not said about all fish stores, but probably most. And if you have a good quiet qt area for the fish at home it shouldn't be to bad stress wise on them.

Yes they do, they're that good. Theres a list on the wall as you walk in that shows you what fish they have in the back in QT. It shows you the date they arrived in store and what date they'll be out of QT. Its the best aquatics store I've ever seen!

Surely though, moving a fish from an LFS where they're in a big group species tank, to a solitary QT tank will be stressfull no matter how quiet it is, and moving them again once they've settled in to a tank full of different types of discus or even different species of fish is more stressfull than one streight move?

Topic - All discus are eating now but the melon is still being a bully so much so that I've only seen the Diamond and the Checkerboard when its feeding time.. I think this is how the others were to begin with though so I'm not worrying so much.

Heres some pics, I can't believe how vivid their colours are!

http://photos-f.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash1/hs453.ash1/24960_10150102203285206_561840205_11260395_6587415 _n.jpg

http://photos-g.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc3/hs413.snc3/24960_10150102203250206_561840205_11260392_7580874 _n.jpg

[DerekFF]

Well qt concerns aside they look healthy and I'd probably chalk it up to pecking order. They may still be a little afraid because of the lower number of fish to hang with.

[SHAD0W]

Yeah that could be it.. There's only 4 of them but the first 2 are brave enough so I'm guessing the others just need a bit more time to settle.

I cannot afford to buy anymore discus at the moment though so time will have to tell.

[kmckim]

Sounds like a pecking order to me as well, matches all my experience with any cichlids.

Its easy to forget that our neon blues and psychedelic striped discus are distant cousins to monsters like green terrors, but sometimes the family lines show through!

[spyder329]

Will this behavior stop? I have one discus that just will not stop bullying another one. I really feel bad for the PB its like he is getting his A$$ kicked and I can not stop it. He hides behind the plants but, the juvenile finds him where ever he is and just pokes at him.

[SHAD0W]

Thanks for your help guys!

I've had the Melon and the Turq 3 weeks now, and the Checkerboard and Blue Diamond 1 week.

The checkerboard has stopped hiding so much now and is being quite adventurous which is great but the melon seems to be concentrating all its pecking order sorting onto the blue diamond so much so that it now has what looks like a scar down its side, this is very worrying. I'm tempted to put the Melon "in the naughty tank" as my girlfriend calls it out of the way while the others settle in. Is this a good idea? Will the Melon's attitude be any better when I reintroduce? How long should I keep it solitary?

[ssevasta]

You should try to get a picture of the "scar" on the side of the fish if possible so the resident experts can rule out any kind of parasite or other issue.

[SHAD0W]

Its not a scar, was his gill plate but he moved so fast it was hard to tell.

I've removed the Melon to the naughty tank to see if it will calm things down. How long must this fish be removed tho alter the pecking order?

I intend on adding 2 more discus at the weekend to make the numbers up to 6 in total. Should I re-introduce the bully melon when I introduce the 2 new discus or should I do it before/after?

[wesleydnunder]

They are establishing a pecking order. Discus are thugs are will beat up on each other. It may settle down or it may continue. The more discus you have the more the aggresion is spread out. Just remember to quarantine any new fish before adding them.

Chris

+1