Social Outcasts

[jalopyhead]

I'm running a 55 gal tank. I currently have 2 large blue discus and 2 small orange discuss in the tank.

In addition, I had 1 more orange 2 white discus and 2 multicolored discus (sorry I don't know the real names.)

Not all of these discuss were in the tank at the same time. The most I had in at the same time was 6.)

Water quality it good, and I do frequent water changes.

I'm quite frustrated with their social outcasting. I've seen it now in 4 discus deaths. It's always that the lowest on the social ladder becomes outcasted until it becomes sickly, and eventually dies. Then, the next lowest on the ladder becomes the outcast and it dies.

They've been numbered in different variations. The tank is certainly large enough to hold my current number of 4, but it is happening again. A second orange one has gone complete pale, rarely eats, and I'm sure will eventually die. One he dies, I'm sure the next smallest one will be taking the brunt of it.

I don't know if you've got any suggestions on the matter, but I'd like to hear what you've got to say.

Jalopyhead

[joanr]

The fish getting bullied is usually the smallest, but not always. When they get bullied they get stressed = sickness, usually Hex or other internal parasites take over. Lots of good food and water helps keep immune systems up even in fish that are taking more than their share of aggression, but it doesn't always help and you will see these deaths. Best way to avoid is to get them in all at once, same size and feed them well, do lots of water changes and worm them as juvies for all the types of worms. Buy one more than you planned on just in case.....Six would not be too many in a 55 gal and would help spread the aggression around better. Four fish is not a good number.

[tcyiu]

My sympathies. Joan R is right on the money.

I was able to raise 4 discus to healthy adulthood but I don't recommend it. It took A LOT of effort of moving fish to the "naughty" tank ... as someone else just called it on another thread (sorry. I can't remember who to credit. I used to just call the quarantine tank, "The Jail").

Sometimes, the bully would go to jail to allow the others to get some breathing room.. Other times, it would be the weakest one because it was being battered too much. Sometimes whole groups would move over just to shake up the pecking order. Bottomline, I am NOT doing that again.

I got seven juvenile discus of the same size from Kenny and I couldn't be happier. They just beat each other up and spread the love evenly. (That said, the weakest one ultimately perished because it was the most stressed. It wasn't necessarily the most harassed.)

Good luck.

Tim

[mmorris]

Water quality it good, and I do frequent water changes.

I'm quite frustrated with their social outcasting. I've seen it now in 4 discus deaths. It's always that the lowest on the social ladder becomes outcasted until it becomes sickly, and eventually dies. Then, the next lowest on the ladder becomes the outcast and it dies.


Jalopyhead

It is quite possible that the social outcast is the social outcast because it is already sick. You do need a minimum of six discus but it sounds like you've had this number before and they still died. Before we can attempt to figure out what the problem is, you need to provide more information.
1) How long have you had the fish before they died?
2) Did you quarantine the newly purchased ones? It only stands to reason that whatever killed the old ones will kill the new ones.
3) Do you have ammonia, nitrite, nitrate and ph test kits? If not, I highly recommend you get them and test your water.
4) What is the tank temperature?
5) How much water do you change, how often, and do you age your water? 6) Is the water you change the same ph and temp as the tank water?

[LizStreithorst]

It is quite possible that the social outcast is the social outcast because it is already sick. You do need a minimum of six discus but it sounds like you've had this number before and they still died. Before we can attempt to figure out what the problem is, you need to provide more information.
1) How long have you had the fish before they died?
2) Did you quarantine the newly purchased ones? It only stands to reason that whatever killed the old ones will kill the new ones.
3) Do you have ammonia, nitrite, nitrate and ph test kits? If not, I highly recommend you get them and test your water.
4) What is the tank temperature?
5) How much water do you change, how often, and do you age your water? 6) Is the water you change the same ph and temp as the tank water?

I agree with Martha. This is not normal. Something else is wrong.

Martha, I don't know if you clicked on this thread because of the title, but I did.

[ockyra215]

I agree with everyone who posted on this most likely your fish are getting ill and the others see it and outcast the weaker fish(survival of the fittest) Its just the circle of life.I my opinion.keep up the water changes and medicate them for worm and such and feed them good healthy food.:DGood Luck with them.