Stunted discus?

[Elizabth]

What does a stunted discus look like? Can't seem to find a pic.

[mlw]

http://i232.photobucket.com/albums/ee70/yimini/Fishtank%20pics/Discus002.jpg

http://i232.photobucket.com/albums/ee70/yimini/Fishtank%20pics/Discus001-1.jpg

[rickztahone]

Check out the beginners section and see the two stickies labeled 'selecting discus' and 'what not to buy'

[Moon]

Of all my 20 or so discus my favourite is a stunted lady Reflection D.

[Darrell Ward]

Lifted these from the internet:

[Darrell Ward]

http://i232.photobucket.com/albums/ee70/yimini/Fishtank%20pics/Discus002.jpg

http://i232.photobucket.com/albums/ee70/yimini/Fishtank%20pics/Discus001-1.jpg


This is the answer for all the people who ask, "Why can't I put juvies in my planted tank"? :D

[Chad Hughes]

This is the answer for all the people who ask, "Why can't I put juvies in my planted tank"? :D

Ouch..... that hurt. :(

[JL15219]

http://i232.photobucket.com/albums/ee70/yimini/Fishtank%20pics/Discus002.jpg

http://i232.photobucket.com/albums/ee70/yimini/Fishtank%20pics/Discus001-1.jpg

WOW those look horrible!!!

[Darrell Ward]

Ouch..... that hurt. :(

Not you Chad, newbies, newbies. :D

[Chad Hughes]

LOL! :scared: Oh good! I was worried that I had a bunch of stunted discus! YIKES! LOL!

Best wishes!

[kitykatfunkiehat]

The eyes on those look massive. Holy cow.

[Disgirl]

I think it might be a good idea to let newbies know something here. Of course the full grown, 6-7" discus is what we all want. BUT, a stunted, large eyed discus can still be a healthy, happy pet to enjoy in a tank. If given good food and good clean and warm water in a clean tank stunted discus will be fine and may even breed, leading to normal sized fry which can grow to the 6-7" discus under more ideal tank and water and food to grow out. Just don't want people with stunted but otherwise healthy fish to think they have fish that don't deserve to live. I have a few "smallish" ones but they are as pretty and healthy as the larger ones in my tank. Just my 3 cents here...
Barb:D

[mjs020294]

I think it might be a good idea to let newbies know something here. Of course the full grown, 6-7" discus is what we all want. BUT, a stunted, large eyed discus can still be a healthy, happy pet to enjoy in a tank. If given good food and good clean and warm water in a clean tank stunted discus will be fine and may even breed, leading to normal sized fry which can grow to the 6-7" discus under more ideal tank and water and food to grow out. Just don't want people with stunted but otherwise healthy fish to think they have fish that don't deserve to live. I have a few "smallish" ones but they are as pretty and healthy as the larger ones in my tank. Just my 3 cents here...
Barb:D

Well said!

Fish in the wild are not born in BB tanks and forced fed. Personally I much prefer to have a nice balanced tank with plants and let the fish develop at their own pace. Happy and healthy is better than large.

[wadewc]

I picked up a 3" discuss over two years ago. I noticed it had problems but I felt sorry for it. When the guy was getting it out of the top tank it fell on the floor. It looked okay for about a week then it went inverted. It has been through alot but I could not bring myself to cull it. It is the PB top center of pic.

Wade

[tcyiu]

I think it might be a good idea to let newbies know something here. Of course the full grown, 6-7" discus is what we all want. BUT, a stunted, large eyed discus can still be a healthy, happy pet to enjoy in a tank. If given good food and good clean and warm water in a clean tank stunted discus will be fine and may even breed, leading to normal sized fry which can grow to the 6-7" discus under more ideal tank and water and food to grow out. Just don't want people with stunted but otherwise healthy fish to think they have fish that don't deserve to live. I have a few "smallish" ones but they are as pretty and healthy as the larger ones in my tank. Just my 3 cents here...
Barb:D

Amen !

I had a blue diamond that was seriously ill twice during growout. The result was it remained stunted. When the other discus grew to be 6-7" this one stayed at about 4" But it was #2 in the pecking order and it was the favorite of all the little kids that would visit us.

Tim

[Elizabth]

Actually, before I came here I was planning on doing just that - putting juvies in my community tank! Glad I did my research!

[Jhhnn]

Those are some badly stunted fish, mlw.

The whole thing can vary by degrees, but it's something that appears to be largely irreversible. If small discus can be fattened up, then they're still OK pets for some people. The sad truth is that fish as skinny and badly stunted as the ones pictured are often irreversibly damaged internally, doomed to an early death.

I don't think that it's possible to "force feed" discus, at all. It's not like putting a goose in a box, a funnel in its mouth, and stuffing it full of food for weeks on end. Wild discus, particularly young discus in the wet season, obviously eat almost constantly, because there's lots of food available. That varies locally, I'm sure. They'll do the same in aquaria, too, if we provide a near constant supply.

I also think that domestic discus will often grow faster than wilds because that's a desirable trait for commercial breeders, so they select fast growers as breeding stock, other factors being equal. That can be amplified like any other trait over generations of selective breeding.

Discus also aren't the kind of fish that will keep growing regardless of their age, like, say, brown trout that'll just get bigger and bigger if they remain healthy and get enough food to do so... Nature didn't make 'em that way.

[RodneyL001]

I am still learning, what is the relationship between plants and a stunted fish.

[rickztahone]

I am still learning, what is the relationship between plants and a stunted fish.

there is no direct correlation IMHO. it goes beyond that statement WRT raising discus in a fully planted. this has to do with people (including me) raising discus in a BB (barebottom) tank due to the ease of clean up. since planted tanks are more difficult (not impossible) to clean, there is a higher chance of stunting your discus. this is one of the main reasons that vets recommend to beginners to start with BB to eliminate variables.

[Jhhnn]

Young discus require enormous amounts of food and very good water quality to thrive and grow out properly. It's almost a contradiction in terms, a balancing act made generally more difficult in planted aquaria.

Viewed head-on, healthy young discus (larger than 2") have a convex shape, kinda broad across the forehead. It reminds me of american buffalo. While round and flat, they're also thick, almost plump. The contest fish raised by Chad and Acroken are great examples of this.

In a group of fish from a common clutch of eggs, siblings, they'll also exhibit relatively uniform size when properly fed. If not, the more aggressive feeders get more, outgrow the others.

So surprisingly large amounts of food are required, enough that water quality will deteriorate quickly, poisoning the fish, unless proper measures are employed. Chad's methods in planted tanks obviously work- low stocking density in large tanks. high technology. ozone. large weekly water changes. Part of the driving force behind it is very high water rates where he lives.

For others, like myself, the easy answer is BB tanks and more frequent partial water changes and poop siphoning. Making it easy requires planning, ingenuity and some investment up front. The easier it is, the more likely we are to do it. Human nature.

One of the more frequently asked questions is "What's the minimum for water changes?" It's really the wrong question, because the only way to know the answer is to fail. Better questions are "How can water changing be made easy?" and "How can I be sure I'm in the safe zone of water quality w/o killing myself to do it?"

[mjs020294]

I have juveniles in a planted tank and the clean up is none existent TBH. Five corys, two plecos, 6 shrimp and a Yoyo loach take care of any uneaten food. Not to mention the Discus, who grace a lot as well. The filters and plants take care of the waste.

We are feeding five or six times a day, an some of the feeds last twenty plus minutes. There is no algae, and the ammonia, nitrite and nitrate readings are all zero. When I disturb the substrate their is no noticeable dirt so we don't vacuum of clean the bottom (yet).

Of course I am doing decent WC's, around 200% a week spread over five days. I think the one thing that is helping us keep on top of it is the usage of a turkey baster at feeding time. It allows us to get the food to all the fish, even the shy less dominant eaters.

[Darrell Ward]

I have juveniles in a planted tank and the clean up is none existent TBH. Five corys, two plecos, 6 shrimp and a Yoyo loach take care of any uneaten food. Not to mention the Discus, who grace a lot as well. The filters and plants take care of the waste.

We are feeding five or six times a day, an some of the feeds last twenty plus minutes. There is no algae, and the ammonia, nitrite and nitrate readings are all zero. When I disturb the substrate their is no noticeable dirt so we don't vacuum of clean the bottom (yet).

Of course I am doing decent WC's, around 200% a week spread over five days. I think the one thing that is helping us keep on top of it is the usage of a turkey baster at feeding time. It allows us to get the food to all the fish, even the shy less dominant eaters.

Time will tell if your method works. Good luck with it. :)

[rey29]

Are all small discus with big eyes are stunted?

[pcsb23]

bit of a thread revival going eh? :evilgrin:

Are all small discus with big eyes are stunted?Yes. :)

[rey29]

Thanks paul. Because i have a leopard discus maybe 2.5 inches. And the eyes are little bit bigger. Are they already stunted even they are just 2.5 inch long?

[rickztahone]

bit of a thread revival going eh? :evilgrin:
Yes. :)

Yes, I've noticed a few myself. I found myself reading the first page and then I saw one of my old replies, lol. It kind of cracked me up.

[RodneyL001]

not to carry this discussion to a ridiculous level, but I'm the runt of my family all of my brothers are over 6' feet tall, I'm 50+ and have had a good life up to this point, I guess I'm glad my mom didn't put me down because I was the smallest of the bunch!!

[rickztahone]

not to carry this discussion to a ridiculous level, but I'm the runt of my family all of my brothers are over 6' feet tall, I'm 50+ and have had a good life up to this point, I guess I'm glad my mom didn't put me down because I was the smallest of the bunch!!

lmao :laugh:

[pcsb23]

Thanks paul. Because i have a leopard discus maybe 2.5 inches. And the eyes are little bit bigger. Are they already stunted even they are just 2.5 inch long?Without seeing the fish in question it is impossible to say for sure. It may still grow some, but I doubt it will now reach it's full potential. That's not to say it won't be worth keeping, stunting is caused by poor husbandry and is not genetic.


not to carry this discussion to a ridiculous level, but I'm the runt of my family all of my brothers are over 6' feet tall, I'm 50+ and have had a good life up to this point, I guess I'm glad my mom didn't put me down because I was the smallest of the bunch!!hehe, there is a difference between being a runt and being stunted, one is in the control of the keeper, the other isn't :)

[LeneePerez]

I think it might be a good idea to let newbies know something here. Of course the full grown, 6-7" discus is what we all want. BUT, a stunted, large eyed discus can still be a healthy, happy pet to enjoy in a tank. If given good food and good clean and warm water in a clean tank stunted discus will be fine and may even breed, leading to normal sized fry which can grow to the 6-7" discus under more ideal tank and water and food to grow out. Just don't want people with stunted but otherwise healthy fish to think they have fish that don't deserve to live. I have a few "smallish" ones but they are as pretty and healthy as the larger ones in my tank. Just my 3 cents here...
Barb:D

THank you! I'm a newbie.... and I really needed to hear this today!! :)

[DISCUS STU]

It's a good idea to remember that stunted fish are that way for a reason and much of the time it's because they may be sick with either bacterial or parasitic infections that may be transmittable to the other fish. It's usually not due to being underfed.

Not all the fish have to be 6-7", some may also just be low in the pecking order and not grow to their maximum size for that reason, especially in a crowded tank, but it's a good idea to make sure that the stunted fish aren't also sick fish.

[candymancan]

I bought a blue turquoise from Petco like 3 months back.. It had a broken arm.. heavy slime coat.. was black.. had ich on it.. and would hide and never came out to eat... I remember how rude people were on fish forums were bashing me for buying it because I felt sorry for it.. I paid $20 for him..

Now hes my biggest discus.. doesn't display his bars anymore.. hes EXTREMELY beautiful.. eats freeze dried blood worms.. and hes the Alpha in the tank..

This was him about 3 weeks after I got him.. still dark.. displaying his bars.. looked stunted.. he was much worse before this first pic.. Now look at him today in the 2nd pic.. Not bad for a $20 sick dying petco discus huh ?

http://i1083.photobucket.com/albums/j385/enclave12/20141022_221528_zpsd16fc427.jpg


http://i1083.photobucket.com/albums/j385/enclave12/20150101_183108_zps76ea3795.jpg