Exposure to chloramines - how dangerous?

[DonMD]

My city water is chlorinated, and also has chloramines. I age the water at least 24 hours, and aerate it. I also use Prime to condition the water, and that's fine.

BUT, when I want to use Potassium Permanganate, the Prime renders it ineffective.

I am considering a PP treatment. What to do? One option is a 100% water change with aerated aged water, then treat with PP for 4 hours, THEN add Hydrogen Peroxide, and then Prime. But in this 4-hour period, the fish would be exposed not only to PP, but also to Chloramines (the chlorine having been eliminated by aeration).

Has anyone had experience with this scenario? Would it be a problem for the discus? Thanks, -Don

[Willie]

I use AmQuel to treat chloramines in my water. PP treatment works fine for me, although it's not my treatment of choice.

Willie

[William Palumbo]

Hi Don...I am sure just for your treatment period, you could find and use another product that removes Chloramines other than PRIME. Another option would be to run the new water thru a GAC filter...Bill

[Rob321]

You are right about this dilemma!

If you use any type of dechlorinator (Prime, Amquel, etc.) in water that you are trying to produce a specific concentration of PP (i.e., KMnO4 – Potassium Permanganate) then you will run into the problem of your dechlorinator reacting with, and deactivating some part, or all, of the PP that you have applied.

I have found that my municipal water supply that contains chloramines must be aerated for approximately 3 days before the chlorine has been eliminated. I found this out by trial and error testing with Orthotolidine reagent, which Aquarium Pharmaceuticals used to supply (~20 years ago), but now I get it from my local hot tub store.

So what I do when I want to treat with PP is to aerate a tub of tap water for at least two days, to reduce the chlorine component down to a relatively safe level then remove the fish from its tank and place it in a 10 ppm bath for twenty minutes.

[nc0gnet0]

When used at proper levels, dechlorinators are gone from your water in approximatley 48 hours. Fill your aging barrel, add your dechlorinator, then let it age and you will be fine. Even if you have a little residual dechlorinator left it will be fine, you just might need to redose with PP. But, remember, not only will dechlorinators deactivate PP, the DOC's in your water will neutralize it as well.

[Jhhnn]

When used at proper levels, dechlorinators are gone from your water in approximatley 48 hours. Fill your aging barrel, add your dechlorinator, then let it age and you will be fine. Even if you have a little residual dechlorinator left it will be fine, you just might need to redose with PP. But, remember, not only will dechlorinators deactivate PP, the DOC's in your water will neutralize it as well.

My very limited experience agrees with this. The few times I've used PP, I had to add more periodically over the 4 hour timeframe to keep the concentration up. The initial weighed/measured dose for 2ppm rendered the water bright pink, caused the fish some distress. After an hour or so, the color was weaker and the fish happier, so I added a partial amount with a pipette to bring the color back. I started getting a color more orange-ish than pink after that, so I judged the make-up quantity going forward more from the fish behavior than color...

Definitely a bit tricky, so you need to monitor the fish the whole time, add PP solution periodically to have the desired effect. Small amounts ( like 1 capful) of hydrogen peroxide quickly deactivate the PP. Prime supposedly works, too, but I had the peroxide, used that at the end of the treatment before a big water change...

[Jhhnn]

Very important addendum- increase aeration a lot when using PP...

[flyman767]

I HAD THE SAME ISSUE. I'VE PURCHASED DISTILLED WATER TO DO A 4 HR DIP WITH PP IN MY QUARNTINE TANK. YOU CAN ALSO USE R/O WATER, AS THIS WILL DECHLORINATE THE WATER WITHOUT THE USE OF CHEMICALS. OTHERWISE, AS I FOUND OUT, IF YOU USE A DECHLORINATOR TO REMOVE CLORINE/CHLORAMINES; THIS WILL NEUTRALIZE THE PP AND CAUSED IT TO BE INEFFECTIVE.

[pcsb23]

If you intend to do a PP treatment then do not use a dechlorinator at all when you do the water change just before doing the PP treatment. The PP is far more corrosive at 2ppm than a relatively small amount of chlorine or chloramine.

The PP can be safely neutralised with products like prime afterwards, though I prefer just doing large water changes with suitably dechlorinated water (in my case re-minerlised RO).

[DonMD]

Thanks everyone for your input, I appreciate it!

[QUOTE=pcsb23;650378]If you intend to do a PP treatment then do not use a dechlorinator at all when you do the water change just before doing the PP treatment. The PP is far more corrosive at 2ppm than a relatively small amount of chlorine or chloramine./QUOTE]

This is what I thought, too. Rather than remove the fish from their tank for a bath in another, smaller tank, I think I'd rather avoid that stress for them (and for me!) and leave them in their own tank for a 4-hr treatment. I plan on changing about 95% of their water with straight tap (heated, of course), add PP, then at the end of 4 hours, neutralize with hydrogen peroxide. And then add Prime.

[pcsb23]

Don, if you can do a water after the treatment too, it will benefit the fish. ime they always look their best after the water change after the PP treatment.