Metro dosage?

[peterhql]

Whats the CURRENT recommended dosage here for a Metro Bath.

One of my fish has long jelly like clear white poopies. He's not eating, at least I haven't seen him eat. Could be 2-3 weeks now. I've seen him mouth a bloodworm or two and then spit it out. I think he's JUST started to look like hes losing weight.

I've been down this road before with juvies, and at the time i was dosing per the instructions on the label for Hikari brand metro. Suffice it to say, I lost both fish.

This time I have pure stuff (i think) and the affected fish is much older so I'm hoping for better luck this time around.

There should be a sticky with recommended dosage levels of common medications from the experts here. Its never the same as the labels. I should probably just PM Dr. Eddie directly...

Thanks Everyone,
Peter

[yim11]

The dosage that has been recommended by a fish vet and professor is:


Bath dose is 250 mg metronidazole per 10 gallons for 12-24 hrs, repeat daily for five days, with approximately 70-100% water change done after 12-24 hr each day prior to re-dosing.


the feed dose for metronidazole--which is 4.5 grams per pound of feed; should be fed for 5 days total (and exclusively--no other food).

HTHs,
-jim

[jimg]

easy way is 1/4 tsp per 41 gal. temp 87deg. I do 50% wc dose in the am then pm 25% wc dose again. I do this for 10 days along with metro flake for white feces.
I have saved a couple fish recently doing this but I caught the white feces withing a couple days. I have many times in the past done 2x this amount with temps to 92 and it only helped for a short while. they then just kept wasting no matter what.
Clear feces may be worms. piperazine

[peterhql]

hmm would appear that i overdosed. I think I did 500 mg/10 gal.

[kaceyo]

500mg/10g is fine. It's what many discus people use although it is twice the usual recommended dose.
If you have the Jehmco pure metro you can dose 1/4tsp per 20gals. Start by doing a large, at least 50%, wc. then dose the tank. Do the same every 24hrs for 10days. I don't raise the temp anymore as I get just as good results without it.

[Eddie]

The dosage that has been recommended by a fish vet and professor is:





HTHs,
-jim


Ditto Jim's suggestion.

500 is used frequently but it can throw fish off their breeding cycles.

[kaceyo]

Ditto Jim's suggestion.

500 is used frequently but it can throw fish off their breeding cycles.

If the fish is sick enough to need a metro treatment then breeding wouldn't be an issue.

[Eddie]

If the fish is sick enough to need a metro treatment then breeding wouldn't be an issue.


Right, but it will take a while to get them back on their saddles.

[jimg]

easy way is 1/4 tsp per 41 gal. temp 87deg. I do 50% wc dose in the am then pm 25% wc dose again. I do this for 10 days along with metro flake for white feces.
I have saved a couple fish recently doing this but I caught the white feces withing a couple days. I have many times in the past done 2x this amount with temps to 92 and it only helped for a short while. they then just kept wasting no matter what.
Clear feces may be worms. piperazine

spoke too soon one of the juvies has it back! I will just cull it. never had a fish survive long after it has white feces returning

[kaceyo]

Peter asked for the current recommended dosage of metro. There was no mention of getting the fish back on a breeding cycle. Even if there had been, that doesn't change the recommended dosage.
Eddie, you've made the same recommended dosage that I did time and time again. What's different about this time?

[Eddie]

Peter asked for the current recommended dosage of metro. There was no mention of getting the fish back on a breeding cycle. Even if there had been, that doesn't change the recommended dosage.
Eddie, you've made the same recommended dosage that I did time and time again. What's different about this time?


Research brother, better knowledge from reading and advice from other professionals. I gave my suggestion, following Jim's advice. The higher amount is used often but can break the breeding cycle of some pairs. How is there a problem with giving additional advice?

[kaceyo]

spoke too soon one of the juvies has it back! I will just cull it. never had a fish survive long after it has white feces returning
You may need to deworm rather than treat with metro. It's your call and I can't judge how bad off the fish is, but it could be worth a try to treat with levamisol. Is it bloated at all?

[jimg]

Kacey i have pure metro from jehmco it's dose is 1/4 tsp per 41. do you just double it? or is there another form of metro they have?
I have doubled the dose in the past and it never worked either so this time I did the recommended dose just longer. but I just found one fish still has white feces.
i also found flagellates in the feces looks like spiro sort of but has to be seen at 1200X.

[jimg]

You may need to deworm rather than treat with metro. It's your call and I can't judge how bad off the fish is, but it could be worth a try to treat with levamisol. Is it bloated at all?
never saw worms scoping. no bloat. a few fish in the tank had the white feces after treatment all clear except this one, so far, all others eat wildly as usual. I thought I caught it early this time too.

[kaceyo]

Kacey i have pure metro from jehmco it's dose is 1/4 tsp per 41. do you just double it? or is there another form of metro they have?
I have doubled the dose in the past and it never worked either so this time I did the recommended dose just longer. but I just found one fish still has white feces.
i also found flagellates in the feces looks like spiro sort of but has to be seen at 1200X.
I use the Jehmco metro also, and I do double the dose, which is closer to 400mg/10gals actually. I've had very good luck using it that way.
Another thing to consider is the possibility of a secondary internal bacterial infection caused by the parasites. In these cases the fish will often be cured of the original parasites only to be hit by the bacterial infection shortly after.
Since your using a scope you could check for signs of worms and flagellates and if neither are present, use kanamycin, an antibiotic, to treat bacteria.

[jimg]

i also found flagellates in the feces looks like spiro sort of but has to be seen at 1200X.
being that I do see flagellates but should be able to see them at 400X. I will treat one more week with 500mg metro.
These are the juvies that also have the gill flukes I mentioned in other posts. Funny thing is when I was told on another site that keeping them at 87 was too high I lowered the temp to 85 and this shows up!
Do you think metro has enough antibiotic properties to help with a secondary infection?

[kaceyo]

i also found flagellates in the feces looks like spiro sort of but has to be seen at 1200X.
being that I do see flagellates but should be able to see them at 400X. I will treat one more week with 500mg metro.
These are the juvies that also have the gill flukes I mentioned in other posts. Funny thing is when I was told on another site that keeping them at 87 was too high I lowered the temp to 85 and this shows up!
Do you think metro has enough antibiotic properties to help with a secondary infection?

I wouldn't depend on metro to treat secondary bacterial infection. As for the flagellates, I've read that they are hard to ID so that may not be what you're seeing.
I'd remove the fish and put it in a hospital tank to treat. Since the other fish seem to be OK there's no need to subject them to more meds. If the second round of metro doesn't work, try the kanamycin. You can treat with metro for up to two weeks if needed.
HTH

[jimg]

yeah I never heard of metro treating internal bacteria but I thought of it as I was answering you and figured I'd throw it out there! This is a stunted juvie so I will treat him separate again just as an experiment, otherwise I will cull him and pay attention to the others. Thanks

[kaceyo]

yeah I never heard of metro treating internal bacteria but I thought of it as I was answering you and figured I'd throw it out there! This is a stunted juvie so I will treat him separate again just as an experiment, otherwise I will cull him and pay attention to the others. Thanks

I think it's worth trying to cure it just as a learning experience. Next time you have to deal with this you'll know what may work, or what may not.

[jimg]

I lose about 1 fish every 8 months to this for years now, never able to permanently cure any fish that ever had it. they usually end up wasting away. Treated with metro a hundred different ways even followed up with de-worming, never ever found any worms or eggs in feces. I have in the past used a syringe and followed all treatments with kanamycin. I went quite awhile this time without seeing this, I thought it may of been since I stopped feeding fbw. was very surprised to see this again.
It never effects any of the breeders,wilds or tanks with one or two fish, only the community and grow-out tanks.
I think it is that something else somewhere is causing it like stress etc. It's funny that most everyone that has discus treats with metro/dewormers etc. should only be wilds with these problems.
I really don't think anyone or very few, with domestics has ever seen hex under a scope, but we all treat for it. Something is being missed or not found yet.Or our waters are no right for them no matter what we do.
Many many people buy discus from top breeders/importers and keep water as recommended only to report dark,hiding in corners, not eating and white feces. if these fish were kept with all the wc and cleanliness everyone swears by, why do we still have it? I think something is missed still or inbreeding is weakening the fish. my wilds never get this......yet!!

[kaceyo]

I think you're right about it's being brought on by stress. As you said, the pairs, which are usually given more water per fish and aren't scrapping with tank mates over food, space etc, don't get it. Wilds may have built up a better resistance to whatever the pathogen is, but that's just a guess.
At this point I'd consider taking the sick specimen to a fish pathologist if you really want to pin it down.

[jimg]

I was going to bring them to a vet in weston ct but she wanted $500 for a full necropsy about 5 years ago!

[kaceyo]

WOW!!! If I remember correctly, they charge around $75 at a university lab. Do you have one near you? They may even do it as a class project if you got on well with the prof.

[jimg]

We do have Cornell university I might try them.

[victor_r]

I was going to bring them to a vet in weston ct but she wanted $500 for a full necropsy about 5 years ago!

wow i called last night for one to my vet and it was $32.00

[jimg]

What will she do for $32? That one I spoke with said they will check internal organs,and do bacteria cultures. She said between $400 to $600,