Shape of albino discus

[ctzeh]

Hi guys, was just looking at pics of albino discus in the forum and noticed that most do not have very round shapes. Is this an inherent trait in albino discus or is it because most traditional discus with poor shapes are culled and hence we do not see those with poor shapes often.

Also, with regards to the crossing of albino discus, has there ever been a cross that has produced undesirable looking discus? I am asking this because since albinos have no black pigment, there is not much that could go wrong colour wise right? I may be wrong, hope to hear some views from the rest.

[Eddie]

Hi guys, was just looking at pics of albino discus in the forum and noticed that most do not have very round shapes. Is this an inherent trait in albino discus or is it because most traditional discus with poor shapes are culled and hence we do not see those with poor shapes often.
I'd say that Albinos used to generally have poor shapes but over the years breeders have really improved shape.

Also, with regards to the crossing of albino discus, has there ever been a cross that has produced undesirable looking discus? I am asking this because since albinos have no black pigment, there is not much that could go wrong colour wise right? I may be wrong, hope to hear some views from the rest.
Yes and no, crossing an non-albino with albino will only give you intermediates. Its only once you cross these offspring or cross with the parent albino that you get albino type. Its important to track the original gene/type that was crossed with the albino so that you can improve/sustain the desired traits of that original type in its albino form.

[Pardal]

In regard to the shape. The albinos strains now days are getting better as is being breed with other strains, for that very same reason to get away from the foot ball shape. in the downside their eyes are not longer that red, or rabit eye, red center pupil and are going toward the lutino.dark center pupil and in some cases no red at all on the iris, in other words we getting away from albinism somewhat but keep the good characteristics lack of the black pigment.
IMHO The worst combinations is when you get some albino in the blue spectrum of color with a red or yellow spectrum. you will get the orange/ yellowish mutt. but if a matter of opinion cause I love my albino blue diamond throwbacks and guess what you can always get some awesome platinums.:D

[ctzeh]

Hi guys, was just looking at pics of albino discus in the forum and noticed that most do not have very round shapes. Is this an inherent trait in albino discus or is it because most traditional discus with poor shapes are culled and hence we do not see those with poor shapes often.
I'd say that Albinos used to generally have poor shapes but over the years breeders have really improved shape.

Also, with regards to the crossing of albino discus, has there ever been a cross that has produced undesirable looking discus? I am asking this because since albinos have no black pigment, there is not much that could go wrong colour wise right? I may be wrong, hope to hear some views from the rest.
Yes and no, crossing an non-albino with albino will only give you intermediates. Its only once you cross these offspring or cross with the parent albino that you get albino type. Its important to track the original gene/type that was crossed with the albino so that you can improve/sustain the desired traits of that original type in its albino form.

Thanks Eddie as always with your prompt replies. Btw, do you think that the conditions that discus are raised under can greatly impact their shapes? i.e. if i have discus fries whose parents do not have great shape but if raised under good conditions, will their shapes be greatly improved?

[ctzeh]

In regard to the shape. The albinos strains now days are getting better as is being breed with other strains, for that very same reason to get away from the foot ball shape. in the downside their eyes are not longer that red, or rabit eye, red center pupil and are going toward the lutino.dark center pupil and in some cases no red at all on the iris, in other words we getting away from albinism somewhat but keep the good characteristics lack of the black pigment.

IMHO The worst combinations is when you get some albino in the blue spectrum of color with a red or yellow spectrum. you will get the orange/ yellowish mutt. but if a matter of opinion cause I love my albino blue diamond throwbacks and guess what you can always get some awesome platinums.:D

Hi Pardal, i totally agree with you that the albinos are moving away from the rabbit eay but perhaps that is a trade off with better shape and health of the traditional discus.

Also what do you mean by 'blue spectrum of color with a red or yellow spectrum'? Do you have any pictures to show as examples?

Cheers
Choong

[Eddie]

Thanks Eddie as always with your prompt replies. Btw, do you think that the conditions that discus are raised under can greatly impact their shapes? i.e. if i have discus fries whose parents do not have great shape but if raised under good conditions, will their shapes be greatly improved?

Yes and no. If a fish is genetically deformed or shaped poorly, the offspring will have this shape. Now, if the fish is poorly shaped from environmental conditions or poor diet at an early stage (i.e. stunted), the fry CAN take a better shape if raised in optimal conditions with regard to excellent food/water. Also, you can selectively breed to improve shape as well, if thats your goal. ;)

[Pardal]

Hi Pardal, i totally agree with you that the albinos are moving away from the rabbit eay but perhaps that is a trade off with better shape and health of the traditional discus.

Also what do you mean by 'blue spectrum of color with a red or yellow spectrum'? Do you have any pictures to show as examples?

Cheers
Choong

ctzeh
I apologize , I was trying to copy/ and paste one of my post is under Kenny's Discus and is call just 18 days after received them but I couldn't but in the second page you can see the juvies, and you will see they are the light/ orange
color this is not the best example since both parents are albinos. I was talking when crossing and albino with a non albino variaty . Lets say I you breed and albino red melon. with a blue fish. their fry is going to have the orange/yellowish mutt color. I am by far not and expert in genetics, and not the
one to say, I just remember about 2 or 3 year ago. I went on a vacation and a Pigeon Blood male decide to go with a Brilliant Blue Turq. in my heavy display planted tank. need it to say all the fry turn the orange color and when they grow develop a severe case of peppering.
I will find the pics in my archives but need it to say I kind ashamed to post these pics because of the heavy peppering.
To wrap it up these were not albino strains but the color's base are what I'm talking about.Again i don't know anything about genetics just IMHO.
In the good note I have now an intentional cross ABDt X Classic Leopard. fry is just one day old and attached. I decide take a break from artificial pics will come soon.

[Rod]

in the downside their eyes are not longer that red, or rabit eye, red center pupil and are going toward the lutino.dark center pupil and in some cases no red at all on the iris, in other words we getting away from albinism somewhat but keep the good characteristics lack of the black pigment.


Albino discus have always had dark red iris, never have i seen a rabbit eyed albino discus. I know because i have owned albinos for many years now, had multiple strains from different suppliers including specimens directly bred from the original mutant strain ,and have bred my own variations by crossing different strains with them. In addition i have imported many albino types for resale in just about every color you can name. I am also a regular at major international discus shows and still i have not seen rabbit eyed discus. IMO they do not and have never existed. There are many levels of albinism, depending on how you define the word the discus is/is not an albino. If you are of the school of thought that says albino = no pigment, then there are no albino discus as they all have pigment. If like me you believe albino is defined by lack of melanin in the iris, then the discus is an albino. There are many levels in between these 2 extremes, imo they are all albinos. I can't see how we are getting away from albinism with the discus, the gene which controls albinism in discus has not changed at all.

[Pardal]

Albino discus have always had dark red iris, never have i seen a rabbit eyed albino discus. I know because i have owned albinos for many years now, had multiple strains from different suppliers including specimens directly bred from the original mutant strain ,and have bred my own variations by crossing different strains with them. In addition i have imported many albino types for resale in just about every color you can name. I am also a regular at major international discus shows and still i have not seen rabbit eyed discus. IMO they do not and have never existed. There are many levels of albinism, depending on how you define the word the discus is/is not an albino. If you are of the school of thought that says albino = no pigment, then there are no albino discus as they all have pigment. If like me you believe albino is defined by lack of melanin in the iris, then the discus is an albino. There are many levels in between these 2 extremes, imo they are all albinos. I can't see how we are getting away from albinism with the discus, the gene which controls albinism in discus has not changed at all.
The lack of black pigment also causes the retina of the eye as seen through the pupil. to appear red in color. The albino rabbit eyes (real albino).
I'm not an expert just have sucessfully keep Discus for 10 years, now. But the information above is from page 19 Trophy Discus 2007 Dick Au .50 years experience. There is also a good picture to descrive it.