Hunger Strike?

[Dave B]

This is another case of me not knowing when/if I should start worrying.

1.problems

The low man on the totem pole was getting bullied a bit, so he started hiding all the time and progressed to not eating. I haven't seen him eat in close to 3 weeks. I moved him into his own tank to see if he'd gain back some confidence, and it seems that he has (noone is picking on him and there's really nothing for him to hide from) and I also sold the fish that was bullying him. After a week in the QT he is still refusing food.

He's not all that active in the QT but I'd expect that of a healthy fish too. Not a whole lot to do down there.

2. Symptoms

Not eating.

I have not seen him poop to say for sure whether that's OK or not, but everything else is normal. And honestly he doesn't even look thin yet.

All the other fish are pigs and pooping normally, for whatever that's worth.

I feel like I need to figure out a way to induce pooping so I can see for sure whether it's white or not. Not really sure that's possible though.

3. What medications/ treatments

none

4. Tank size and age, number and size of fish

120, old, 7 4-5" discus and breeding harem of 6 geophagus


5. Water change regime/ how long has tank been running/ bare bottom or gravel/ do you age your water?

every couple days / years (though only started discus recently) / no

I had been heavily salting about a month ago but have eased that off, if that makes any difference, though there's still plenty in the tank.

6 Parameters and water source;

86°, 7.5 0/0/never exceeds 10/ chicago tap

7. Any new fish/plants added recently

No.

[PAR23]

I had a similar situation where my fish was bullied to the point where he stopped eating. I removed the aggressor and hoped for the best. I waited 10 days and he still did not eat.....On day 5 I increased the temp to 90F. He otherwise looked healthy and behaved normally. After posting here and accepting suggestions, I started him on Metro 500mg/10G 3x a day and increased temp to 92 for total of 5 days. On day 4 he started to eat and is doing well today.

[Chad Hughes]

What are you feeding?

Before medicating or making any other rash decisions do some simple things.

Increase temperature to just about 90 and try and entice the fish with other foods. Live foods, blood worms, FDBW, etc. Try and get the fish to take something. Once the appetite is stimulated you should be able to transition the fish back to your staple.

Hope that helps!

[Dave B]

Thanks Peter and Chad...

The other discus are actually starting to take pellets, but this guy has been getting blood worm, which has been the discus staple for me. I need to get some live stuff. I've never used that before though... always been a little hesitant to trust it, even though I know there are legit BW sources here.

I agree about not medicating yet... I just gave him some fresh water, a heater bump, and some extra salt. Maybe I'm imagining things but I swear he's swimming around happily already, which is surprising because I also moved the tank a few feet, which is always stressful. I'll give it some time to settle and attempt another feeding of bloodworm tonight.

[Eddie]

Yup. this is why I don't ever feed bloodworms. Does zero for their health or vitality and discus will refuse other foods if you feed them bloodworms.

[Chad Hughes]

As Eddie pointed out, feeding worms can sometimes create a picky eater. I think you have a little bit of a different situation dealing with a bullied fish.

Any kind of worm should never be a staple, simply a treat. That being said, I would get him at least eating again. Once you've achieved a decent appetite begin to turn the fish back over to staple such as beefheart, flake, whatever. Use the worms as an occassional treat if possible.

Best wishes!

[Dave B]

Interesting. My original discus is picky for that exact reason. All the others have happily accepted pellets (which is great, because I initially started feeding pellet because they sank and thus distracted the orangeheads that were getting all the food, and now they've turned the tables and are stealing their food) except for him.

This guy won't eat bloodworm or anything though. And just now when I went to check on him he was breathing quickly. That might just be from me darting into the room though. We'll see if it persists. I'm at 88 right now. I need a better heater to get that tank to 90, I guess.

[jimg]

Temps that high are low in o2. get water to sheet, (from hob filter) or add airstones. why all the salt?

[Dave B]

Temps that high are low in o2. get water to sheet, (from hob filter) or add airstones. why all the salt?

There is plenty of extra aeration.

The salt was from when I was worried about a different fish's breathing. I've been taking my time easing down from it for a few other reasons. That's in the main tank, though. This fish is isolated right now.

[jimg]

If it don't eat in a few days/week with higher temps and good wc's I would think about a dose of metro.

[Dave B]

I gave it a water change and three hours later it was dead.

The speed of that mirrors that of forgetting to put Prime in, but that wasn't the case. Nothing was wrong. Filtration, temp, additives, air, etc were fine. I have had several mystery deaths in my tanks lately (not the Discus tank, thankfully). I'm a little thrown off by all this.

[Eddie]

I gave it a water change and three hours later it was dead.

The speed of that mirrors that of forgetting to put Prime in, but that wasn't the case. Nothing was wrong. Filtration, temp, additives, air, etc were fine. I have had several mystery deaths in my tanks lately (not the Discus tank, thankfully). I'm a little thrown off by all this.

Mystery deaths, might be toxins. Some fish will react sooner than others. Any symptoms prior to the deaths?

[PAR23]

Wow Dave....Sorry to hear you lost your fish......I'm just wondering how much water did you change?

[Chad Hughes]

Mystery deaths, might be toxins. Some fish will react sooner than others. Any symptoms prior to the deaths?

+1

Sorry to hear of your loss.


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[Dave B]

Mystery deaths, might be toxins. Some fish will react sooner than others. Any symptoms prior to the deaths?

None whatsoever.

Definitely sounds like a toxin issue, but I don't have a clue what it could be. It was spread out across two hospital tanks and my cousin's tank (just a 46g full of tetras and mollies that I've been babysitting while he moves twice in three months). Unfortunately two of them were his most colorful and interesting fish (rainbows). A Geophagus Abalios in another tank was the weakest of his group so perhaps he just got attacked, though it didn't appear to be anything bad if it was.

But if it's toxins, the main discus tank, which gets 50% every other day or 3, ought to be the most at risk... and they're all doing fine. Which confuses me more.

It was a 50% WC for this discus in his 20g QT. Temps matched, I did add Prime, and he had two air pumps going. When I found him it looked like he had deliberately burrowed his way down into a corner between sand and a rock and a heater. More so than any amount of the filter's current could've done. It took some effort to get him out.

Needless to say, I'm doing laps today keeping a very close eye on all the tanks. I added more de-chlor stuff too just because it seemed sort of like a sudden chloramine addition, even though I know that doesn't make sense either... otherwise I'd have entire tanks full of dead fish (I did a 50% for my Africans as well right after that.)

[Eddie]

Did you add the prime before filling or after?

[Dave B]

At the very beginning of the fill, as per my usual habit.

In the past I have forgotten and added it at the end, and never had a problem. But that was pre-discus. I feel like all my previous fish experience goes out the window with these fish.