What in the world are these?

[alleykat0498]

Just noticed them this morning, the fish is still eating and acting normal. I don't believe its ich. I've already done an 80% wc.

[Stag]

Pop that temp up to 90 ASAP and keep checking on it. In the mean time fill out the sick fish questionnaire.

[alleykat0498]

DISEASE QUESTIONNAIRE


Problem

1. Please explain the problems with your fish/when and how they started
small white spots that are spread across one fish in my display. The affected discus is also lethargic.




2. Symptoms (i.e. turning dark, excess slime, not eating, clamped fins, flashing, darting, clamped gills, white/yellow/green poop, hiding, headstanding or tailstanding, white on tips of fins, rotting or fungus, blisters/ white zits on fish, bloated, cloudy eyes, wounds)


turning dark. excess slime clamped fins and white zits



3. What medications/ treatments that you have already tried and results. Include dosages and duration of treatment.

I'm running the temp up to 88 and added 1tbsp of salt per 20 gallons, also did an 80% wc



Tank/Water

4. Tank size and age, number and size of fish
180 gal 8 months old, affected discus is 6.5"


5. Water change regime/ how long has tank been running/ bare bottom or gravel/ do you age your water?
Gravel substrate, 50-75% every other day wc's water is stable at 7.1



6 Parameters and water source;

- temp _83____

- ph __7.1___

- ammonia reading __0__

- nitrite reading _0___

- nitrate reading __<5__

- well water __N__

- municipal water __Y__

7. Any new fish/plants added recently
added 2x 2.5" wilds about 2 weeks ago, all fish have been fine since and this began overnight as the spots etc werent there last night

[moik]

do not raise temp leave it 82/84 degrees...do a massive water change and start to be more water quality oriented/tank cleanliness..plus feed a variety of good foods..those white pimples are from poor water quality /too many organics in tank and a lacking diet is the believed reasons..

[Eddie]

Hmm, tough situation. A 180 with a gravel bottom is working against you in this situation. To be honest, if its just the one fish, I'd set up a hospital tank and pull just that fish, do a salt dip on it and return it to the hospital (NOT THE MAIN TANK). Your water changes seem pretty good for that size of a tank. What type of filter are you running and have you cleaned it at all. There may be decaying food in there, causing the water to be junky no matter how much water change.

[jimg]

How were the nitrates just before these white dots appeared?

[alleykat0498]

Thanks for the replys guys. I clean the filters roughly once a month and normally there's not much in them. I run two xp4's and I gravel vac every time I do a water change. I did feed some live bw a few days before this occurred but all of the fish ate them and only the one was affected. The normal routine is prime reef flake in the am, then frozen blood worm, then beef heart in the evening. Sometimes ill mix feeding 2 and 3 together.

Fortunately my 2 heaters haven't been able to get the temp much over 86 so ill drop it back down to 82. When the lights come on ill determine if the situation has worsened, if so another huge wc and more salt.

[alleykat0498]

She looks much better this morning, the spots are less noticable and it seems they are fewer in numbers

[alleykat0498]

I now have 2 dark discus, doing yet another large water change in hopes that the salt upset the other...

[Eddie]

My guess is, the live worms brought something in. Its hard to say since you have a few variable. Adding new fish 2 weeks ago could very well be the culprit. Seems like a bug of some sort. Tough call here and your tank is display tank so treatment will be difficult.

[zimmjeff]

I know that when I had a gravel bottom in my 75 no matter how much and how well I cleaned my gravel it still had a ton of nastys in it.

[alleykat0498]

Thanks again for the info guys, since its affected my adult pair I've set up a hospital/qt tank, but I broke the heater that was large enough to keep it 82-84. I'll pick one up tomorrow and transfer them when the temp comes up. I also have more discus coming in this week so I need to get to the bottom of this QUICK!

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[vera]

I had the same situation when added a new fish (elephant nose ) after only 2 weeks of QT
do the proper QT procedure b4 placing new comers

[alleykat0498]

Any suggestions on where to start with treatment? Meds etc? There slowly withering away. Still dark, clumps of excess slime, lethargic etc.

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[TURQ64]

Sure would have been nice to have a photo..I hate making totally blind med calls...If it's still similar to ich, 'Quick Cure' or Malachite Green..general external 'bugs', PP (Potassium Permanganate)..And lastly, Metronidazole......Change more water, and we'll see how things look....New heater yet??

[jimg]

salt dips or pp then furan 2 or furanase in qt temp no higher than 84

[alleykat0498]

I'll get ya a photo as soon as I get to the house, im at work atm and ill be picking up the heater for the hospital tank on the way home.

They look pretty much exactly like they do on page one.

[alleykat0498]

Picked up a heater, and searched and searched for PP and couldnt find anything anywhere. Only meds I could find locally with metro was tetra parasite guard... any opinions?

[alleykat0498]

http://img.tapatalk.com/b8d25b67-9f78-f727.jpg
http://img.tapatalk.com/b8d25b67-9f8f-067e.jpg
Both fish are hiding in the corner and very little color with little to no appetite.

[alleykat0498]

Okay I've qtd the fish into a 37 gal hospital tank and dosed for parasites prazi and metro. How soon should I do the first water change?

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[jimg]

I would redose with wc 1x a day. I would not have chose that treatment though. i am not one for metro and prazi together. they have different time schedules. prazi needs to be in the water to slowly dissolve for about 4 days at a time, metro only lasts less than a day. so every time your doing wc's to redose metro, your dumping good prazi down the drain
jmo

[discusdaddy]

I too have discus acne on my discus looking similar to yours ??? seems other two not affected and have not added fish in a long time ???

[ShinShin]

Prazi and metro are fine together. Prazi does not leave the water so just replace according to percentage of water that you change. However, I see no reason for using it in this case. Good for tapeworms and flukes. I would lose the gravel, treat with malachite green/formalin as someone suggested. I would then keep an eye on them. Do they eat? No? Try metro.

Change water. Lots of water. All the time. Not just when your fish get sick. If you do so, and clean the filters, they may not get sick at all. Feed something else besides the live blackworms.

[shoveltrash]

I'm a newbie, but since joining this forum have gone BB (I had gravel). I can only HIGHLY recommend getting RID of gravel substrate! even if you just replace it with sand. gravel has way too many nooks/crannies for food & debris to fall into......and hide, and decay, etc. as above, I do subscribe to "cleanliness => better health" to avoid issues (filter cleaning, daily WCs).

good luck with your fish, please do keep updating.

[discusdaddy]

My fish with zits is o.k. just bummed out about it, he would just get a couple and they would go away, changed back to r/o with big water change and then he got a hole bunch of them?? he has bounced back from being so bummed now they are slowly going away. Please do not start with the med soup of death unless absolutely needed, stay clean and they should come round is what has worked for me.

[ShinShin]

It was already suggested to the poster not to use all the meds he was going to use because they are ineffectiove for this malady. It is most likely caused by a protozoa that attaches to the skin of the discus, burrows in and lays eggs. These eggs are released from the pustuales and sink to the bottom where they survive in the substrate until they hatch. The larvae will then swim to a host (discus) and repeat the cycle. The malachite green/formalin will kill the larval stage, ending the cycle sooner. This is hardly a "med soup of death.

Well maintained and BB tanks rarely have this problem.

Mat

[discusdaddy]

PP'd 4hr bath and next day and 90% gone. Mat, You said "mall lady" :)LOL . So what is the m,green/formalin mix, is it sold premixed ??? Note: that rams do not far well in my pp bath :(.

[discusdaddy]

o.k. quick cure had a brain fart?? :confused:

[lipadj46]

yes quick cure