Raising Juvies Outside

[Second Hand Pat]

Anyone ever do this? I can see the need for a tight cover to keep the juvies in and other critters out plus need to determine if a constant temp can be maintained. I am not thinking a pond as much as a dedicated tank, still maintaining feeding and WCs, basically all the normal care. The tank would be a 100 gallon plastic tank so downside is only being able to see the fish from the top down.

[Skip]

i don't see why it would not work

[Second Hand Pat]

i don't see why it would not work

me either

[Skip]

that large volume of water should retain most of the heat.. if its just to grow out..

i have thought about this too.. :)

[Second Hand Pat]

Skip, my biggest concern about temp is keeping it in the 80s. Summertime is florida is mid-90s in the afternoons.

[Skip]

well, set it up.. with no fish. and see how it fluctuates..

john fish house had no a/c.. and it was hot as hell in there!

[LizStreithorst]

There was someone here who tried it years ago. She lived in south Louisiana, if I'm not mistaken. She put them in a swimming pool. She wasn't happy with the results. I'm afraid that's all I remember.

[JenTN]

There was someone on a forum who did grow-outs in a tank on a back porch but like Liz my memory is fuzzy. I think this instance was successful, but I dont think it was Discus. I want to say it was African Cichlids but dont hold me to it. It was probably guppies. Or puppies. Lol.

[John_Nicholson]

Jim Quarles did this years ago in a swimming pool out in CA. Worked fine for him. As long as the water stays warm you should be in great shape.

-john

[vicdiscus]

What I heard someone discus put in in the cage into river for summer time. I believe the river temperature was around 80's.

[Second Hand Pat]

There was someone here who tried it years ago. She lived in south Louisiana, if I'm not mistaken. She put them in a swimming pool. She wasn't happy with the results. I'm afraid that's all I remember.

I remember you mentioning this Liz and living in a state where every third person has a pool I can see this not working too good. Hard to maintain a pool to exacting standards, it is just too big and without chemical aids it would just be an algae pit.

[Second Hand Pat]

Jim Quarles did this years ago in a swimming pool out in CA. Worked fine for him. As long as the water stays warm you should be in great shape.

-john

I would love to see that. Here in Fla pools turn into algae pits without chemicals. Ca is cooler so that may have helped.

[John_Nicholson]

I would love to see that. Here in Fla pools turn into algae pits without chemicals. Ca is cooler so that may have helped.

Fish like algae. In fact it is probably helpful.

-john

[John_Nicholson]

Ohh and I also went to the lady's house that raised them outside in LA. We can all talk about it at NADA.....for those of you not going it is just one more thing that you will be missing out on.........LOL.

-john

[JenTN]

Ohh and I also went to the lady's house that raised them outside in LA. We can all talk about it at NADA.....for those of you not going it is just one more thing that you will be missing out on.........LOL.

-john

That and the cross-dressing? That's right, I heard.

[Second Hand Pat]

Ohh and I also went to the lady's house that raised them outside in LA. We can all talk about it at NADA.....for those of you not going it is just one more thing that you will be missing out on.........LOL.

-john

deal John

[nwehrman]

One more thing to look forward too... Good topic also!



Nicole

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[Niblet]

We converted our swimming pool into a pond 3 years ago. We filled in the deep end then lined the shallow end so it is now 15,000 gallons. We have a large bio filter flowing over a waterfall and lots of floating plants. The rocks that the waterfall spills over are now nicely covered with algae, which also helps to reduce nitrates (giant algae scrubber!) We have some freefloating algae in the spring before the plant growth really kicks in, but after that, it is VERY clear. Plus, a little algae in the water doesn't bother the fish. We have it stocked with koi....4.5 feet deep. We can swim with them, one of my summer joys! We also have a 300 gallon rubbermaid livestock tank we use as a HT or growout for the koi babies. I don't think our temps would be warm enough for discus without a heater, but those tanks are sturdy and totally algae free in the shade with a tetra bio pond filter. You are full of ingenuity - I bet you could make it work!
http://i978.photobucket.com/albums/ae261/franceshaskins/Pondwaterfalloff1.jpg

[Chicago Discus]

First I thought how crazy is that then I realized where you live.....LOL.....I think its a great idea I would probably not put them near the sun or direct light it might me a bit much.......Josie

[zimmjeff]

your evil John pure evil.

[John_Nicholson]

It has been said of me........

-john

[Second Hand Pat]

We converted our swimming pool into a pond 3 years ago. We filled in the deep end then lined the shallow end so it is now 15,000 gallons. We have a large bio filter flowing over a waterfall and lots of floating plants. The rocks that the waterfall spills over are now nicely covered with algae, which also helps to reduce nitrates (giant algae scrubber!) We have some freefloating algae in the spring before the plant growth really kicks in, but after that, it is VERY clear. Plus, a little algae in the water doesn't bother the fish. We have it stocked with koi....4.5 feet deep. We can swim with them, one of my summer joys! We also have a 300 gallon rubbermaid livestock tank we use as a HT or growout for the koi babies. I don't think our temps would be warm enough for discus without a heater, but those tanks are sturdy and totally algae free in the shade with a tetra bio pond filter. You are full of ingenuity - I bet you could make it work!
http://i978.photobucket.com/albums/ae261/franceshaskins/Pondwaterfalloff1.jpg

Gorgous Fran, I would be using a 100 gallon livestock tank for the juvies.

[Rummy]

One potential problem that comes to mind is the decrease in human interaction from the front of the tank. It makes me wonder if the juvies may have a harder time adjusting socially with humans when they move indoors later. Pat, I know that you will continue with constant interaction. It is just a thought, in general.
I once held some guppies and an angel outdoors in a 20 gal. They were all very happy and reproduced like crazy. The rains did not allow the water temperature to remain high enough, however. Mind you, that it was a small tank, partial shade and packed full of water lettuce.

And I am glad I am not the only one that has thought about a swimming pool. I thought I had finally gone over the deep end. :p

[Second Hand Pat]

First I thought how crazy is that then I realized where you live.....LOL.....I think its a great idea I would probably not put them near the sun or direct light it might me a bit much.......Josie

Josie, my wilds mentor Nandi (NANDiscus here in simply) was recommending a little sunlight. He said the juvies develop color faster with a little sunlight. I am presuming he knows this first hand as he was wildly success with breeding and raising his wild Xingu's.

[Niblet]

I think it is an exciting idea and I hope you give it a try. I will be watching this thread!

[Rummy]

About the color, I have heard that many times. I try to keep my tanks near windows for that reason. I understand that koi and goldfish people prefer their fish raised outdoors for the same reason. I wonder if anyone has done a study on that.

[John_Nicholson]

Try it with a batch of angelfish and the results will blow your mind....

-john

[Second Hand Pat]

Well guys, after I get back from the NADA show we will give it a go. I already have all the stuff I need except the drain plug for the livestock tank. Let's hope the feed store as an extra one.

If this goes well with my older Tefe juvies maybe I will try with my contest juvies once they reach the two inch mark. I can just see me documenting this in the contest thread :p

[Second Hand Pat]

Try it with a batch of angelfish and the results will blow your mind....

-john

Sounds like you have tried this firsthand

[John_Nicholson]

I have been around this game a long time and have tried almost everything.....

-john

[Second Hand Pat]

Looking forward to talking in Atlanta John

[nc0gnet0]

Rather than a 100 gallon tank why not go with a 400 gallon rectangular intex pool? These are used all the time for koi shows and overwintering. You would want the ones that are supported but tubing and not inflatable. A larger body of water will be less prone to big temperature swings.

[Second Hand Pat]

Rick, that sounds like an above ground pool. One time I do have to be careful with is the Ph swing in my tap water (7.4 to 8.2) so replacement water does have to be aged. Also we are only talking about 40 juvies here.

[Larry Bugg]

The first Angels I bought to breed came from a guy here in Atlanta that would use a outdoor pond during the Summer to hold a huge group of his growouts. Great fish.

[LizStreithorst]

I could do that too. I have 150 gallon containers used on the coast for keeping shrimp alive. My problem is that I suck at selling. Also, the only kind of fish I know how to ship are Discus. I have some strains that I'm playing with. It would be nice to have a market for my best ones.

[nc0gnet0]

Rick, that sounds like an above ground pool.

It is, can be assembled in ten minutes and taken down as fast.


One time I do have to be careful with is the Ph swing in my tap water (7.4 to 8.2) so replacement water does have to be aged.

If your only doing 25% daily water changes I don't think that would be a concern, and for that volume of water 25% would be more than enough. Seeing how your outdoors you could throw in some water hyacinths to gobble up the nitrates and provide some shade/cover.



Also we are only talking about 40 juvies here.

Perfect...10 gallons per fish lol. I would actually try this myself, however here in michigan the time I could actually do it (seasonal) is a lot less than you in florida.

[Second Hand Pat]

This is a great thread and Rick, you are a bad influence...that 400 gallon rectangular intex pool is sounding quite feasible. Can you supply a link one of this type of pool. :)

[nc0gnet0]

I got mine from craiglist used. I think that would actually be preferable just in case the liner was treated (they are not supposed to be). The rectangular ones are getting hard to come by, but no reason you couoldn't go round. Just don't get the inflatables, get the ones supported by the metal tubes.

[JenTN]

I swear I saw the rectangular ones @ Big Lots last month. Boy would my kids be peeved if I put up a pool for fish instead of them.

[LizStreithorst]

Allow them to share it with the fish. Just tell them that they're not allowed to pee in it.

[JenTN]

Allow them to share it with the fish. Just tell them that they're not allowed to pee in it.

Lol. I have a crazy nutcase neighbor that watches our backyard like a hawk. It would almost be worth it to see her reaction.

[strawberryblonde]

Oh my gosh, I would LOVE to do something like this. Just a few problems that I can see (for my own situation).

1) The temps reach the low 60's at night in the summers

2) The temps often reach the low 60's during the day in the summer

3) The Dog. Can we say sushi snack?

4) My two cats....and the Dog.

6) Oh yeah, did I mention the temps? LOL

But hey, today got all the way up to 78 degrees! First time all year that we've climbed out of the 60's.

[Second Hand Pat]

Toni, right now it is 73. High today was 92 :p

I lived in Colorado at about 6500 feet and would always wonder if it was going to get warm. Would about June.

[shoveltrash]

oh Pat what a great project! I'll be following this with interest :D


......and Fran I LOVE that pond!!!!!!!! beautiful

[Second Hand Pat]

Trish, didn't get to excited. Haven't told the hubby yet BUT these pools to not seem to expensive but will definitely post back.

[Altum Nut]

We have a friend here who puts his Platties, Swords, and various other African Cichlids in his pond during the summer to grow out. We are amazed how large they get as he always wins various fish show classes. I think he also does it with some plecos. The down-fall is he has had some visitors (Herring Gull) scoop the odd one for a snack.
Would be interesting to see how you make out Pat with the Discus juvie experiment if you follow through.

...Ralph

[nc0gnet0]

The down-fall is he has had some visitors (Herring Gull) scoop the odd one for a snack.

Some type of netting would take care of that. Or a dog ;). For water changes you could also get yourself a kiddie pool and give your legs and feet a good rinse, then hop in the pool itself to do your cleaning. I had an FX5 hooked up to my pool for filtration, but you will need to get it at a level lower than the pool itself, easy enough if on soil (dig a hole). I would love to do this as well, just don't have the temps here to make it feasable for a long enough period of time.

The biggest downfall to the whole project is you really won't be able to see them all that well as discus are not a fish made to be viewed from above like a koi is.

Rick

[Second Hand Pat]

We have a friend here who puts his Platties, Swords, and various other African Cichlids in his pond during the summer to grow out. We are amazed how large they get as he always wins various fish show classes. I think he also does it with some plecos. The down-fall is he has had some visitors (Herring Gull) scoop the odd one for a snack.
Would be interesting to see how you make out Pat with the Discus juvie experiment if you follow through.

...Ralph

Ralph, I'm going to test the temp of my horse tanks in the morning and after tomorrow afternoon. I am not concerned about them cooling off as much as how hot it gets during the day. I can just see it...Pat the discus farmer...oh boy.

[Second Hand Pat]

Some type of netting would take care of that. Or a dog ;). For water changes you could also get yourself a kiddie pool and give your legs and feet a good rinse, then hop in the pool itself to do your cleaning. I had an FX5 hooked up to my pool for filtration, but you will need to get it at a level lower than the pool itself, easy enough if on soil (dig a hole). I would love to do this as well, just don't have the temps here to make it feasable for a long enough period of time.

The biggest downfall to the whole project is you really won't be able to see them all that well as discus are not a fish made to be viewed from above like a koi is.

Rick

Rick, the netting is a great idea and would take care of all except the coons. I'm not ever should if they would be a problem, depends on the depth of the pool. As far as viewing the discus. When cleaning don a mask, fins and snorkel and good to go.

[Second Hand Pat]

Rick, something like this?

http://www.walmart.com/catalog/product.do?product_id=19414904&findingMethod=rr

[nc0gnet0]

Yup, thats one of the many they have. I like the rectangular ones better, but thats just me.

[Second Hand Pat]

Rick, that baby holds 4400 gallons

[Trier20]

A .22 works good for coons :) just don't shoot the tank lol

[nc0gnet0]

http://www.intexcorp.com/index.php/home/above-ground-pools/metal-frame-pools/small-rectangular-frame-pools/58983e.html

and then you need one of these:
http://www.intexcorp.com/index.php/home/above-ground-pools/agp-accessories/pool-maintenance/58948e.html

;)

[Second Hand Pat]

Has to be red :D

[Second Hand Pat]

Another possible use for a pool like this is to condition wilds for possible breeding, perhaps even heckels since I understand a possible impediment to heckel breeding is small water volume.

[nc0gnet0]

Has to be red

You lost me here.

The biggest issue you will have when trying this is to make sure they find thier food. They won't be used to looking around that big of an area for say a cube of FDBW. Live foods that stay good in water for a period of time would be ideal, like baby guppies, red wigglers, etc.

Your idea on breeding wilds would be interesting to try.

[JenTN]

You lost me here.

The biggest issue you will have when trying this is to make sure they find thier food. They won't be used to looking around that big of an area for say a cube of FDBW. Live foods that stay good in water for a period of time would be ideal, like baby guppies, red wigglers, etc.

Your idea on breeding wilds would be interesting to try.

How bout one of these hand shaped pillows with a food dispenser attached :D74225

[Second Hand Pat]

You lost me here.

The biggest issue you will have when trying this is to make sure they find thier food. They won't be used to looking around that big of an area for say a cube of FDBW. Live foods that stay good in water for a period of time would be ideal, like baby guppies, red wigglers, etc.

Your idea on breeding wilds would be interesting to try.

A red auto poop cleaner vs a yellow one :)

Nandi suggested on the feeding to teach the juvies to feed from the hand. They already do this will need to teach them to come to one place for feeding.

[Lenin]

How would the cleaning the pool work? Water changes frequently and %?

[ockyra215]

Pat I had wanted to try putting a tank outside on my dads porch/lanai when i lived in florida. I dont think id use a pond that was dug into the ground. Oh and ofcourse make sure the litte lizard critters dont invade it lol. I am curious of your results.

[Second Hand Pat]

How would the cleaning the pool work? Water changes frequently and %?


For the cleaning part, except in red :)
http://www.intexcorp.com/index.php/home/above-ground-pools/agp-accessories/pool-maintenance/58948e.html

25% at a time to avoid a nasty ph swing at least a couple times a week perhaps. I actually need to have this discussion with Nandi since he has done this form of raising juvies.