growing out piwows??

[spiffyfish]

Ok so tomorrow i get 4 piwow turqs from kraig. Im just wondering what the odds of a novice discus keeper growing them out to all the nice adult ones you see here. I know there are a million variables, just wanting to know providing all the general care and maintenance to some juvies what the odds are of getting the results of the amazing ones you see on this site.

[Harry Marsh]

Too many variables, as mentioned

Water parameters? Schedule?

One mess up and they are all dead, regardless of novice or pro

That being said, if you keep at it, a novice can produce nice fish
The problem is that people are fine with water changes for a month, but month 7,8,9 can slip away from you

[spiffyfish]

Ive had fish from kenny now since january and the worse case is they get a 50% water change every other day. Which is what i would be doing with my piwows. Try for everyday but worse case every other day. Ive even trained myself to do this with the other tanks and species of fish now that i have started keeping discus. By the way your fish are really nice did you buy them as adults?

[Bill63SG]

75% or more wc every day.Thats the odds.Twice a day,better odds.

[Skip]

Ok so tomorrow i get 4 piwow turqs from kraig. Im just wondering what the odds of a novice discus keeper growing them out to all the nice adult ones you see here. I know there are a million variables, just wanting to know providing all the general care and maintenance to some juvies what the odds are of getting the results of the amazing ones you see on this site.

chances.. slim..
but you will learn padawan..

in two years you will have your results.. and you will be able to have a better idea..

[spiffyfish]

thanks Skip, i guess i will just see i know its always better to buy adults but idk when the next time for some piwows will be and i like the challenge of trying to grow them out. i guess only time and my ruitine will tell but i sure would like them to get big and look good. Kraigs show fish were awesome i couldnt imagine 4 of those in my tank.

[Skip]

spiffy.. few people can grow them out like that..

but if you can get 6".. you have done good :)

[spiffyfish]

ive always wondered why it is so hard to get that large size, is it the amount of free time breeders may have or is it experience?? or a little of both.

[Skip]

food, water changes, repeat..

they have hundreds of fish to chose from.. to get just one...

we try to start with a small group of 6-10 juvies. in one tank.. they can have hundreds of tanks..

maybe we should go to Asia to visit DISCUS FARMS>>

[spiffyfish]

man would that be nice.. id love to see how they do things and look at their facilities.

[Cameronv]

Piwow discus aren't different than any other discus. You sound pretty set on your wc schedule. That and proper care will produce a fine sized specimen. I'm not that good about my wc schedule and my piwow discus having been growing very steadily. I'm very happy with them, I absolutely love their color. My piwow stock are particularly aggressive lol.

Kraig brought in some great fish that look very promising.

My cobalt in my avatar is a monsterrrr, he dwarfs that picture these days. Love that big bully.

[spiffyfish]

if you have updated pics of either one be my guest and post them. i get mine tomorrow, so i have a ways to go on growing them out. ive gone on Alex's website a few times and just stare at all his good looking fish and hope i can take the ones i am getting from him and get them to look like that.

[Cameronv]

Here ya go, not the best picture. Took it 5 mins ago.
http://i.imgur.com/UKsVw.jpg?1

[Brent1972]

As you are starting with very good quality discus you have a head start , I would do 2 x 50%+ water changes every day for constant water quality and feed 8-10 times a day . The more you can spread the feeding out the better so there belly's are always full.

[DirtyDutch]

The odds can vary quite alot depending on your tank size, water changes, feeding regimen, starting size etc. I know when you buy Piwows from Alex himself, all RT are selected by color/patern from about 4" and up. The way I'd do it is grow them out in lets say a 55 bare bottom with 2 times 50% water changes, feeding 8 times a day with for instance 5x beefheart mix, mysis, black worms (no bloodworms, artemia etc.) and a good granulate. Keep the water fairly hard with a ph of about 6.8, and stimulate their appetite with a temperature of about 86 degrees. This would increase your odds if you ask me, however shape can't be changed by genetics.

[strawberryblonde]

Ok, feeling silly for asking a dumb question here, but are Piwow's that much harder to grow out than other good quality discus?

My curiosity got the best of me since I managed to grow out 3 discus of a group of five to beyond 8" and the other 2 clock in at 7.5". They aren't Piwow's though, so now I'm wondering if I just happened to pick easy ones to grow.

[spiffyfish]

No i think they are all the same. They are still discus, i was just wanting to know because you rarely see large fish on here that are grown from juvies in the u.s. At least i havent seen a ton, most of them are imported and purchased at a larger size. I opted to try and grow them out from around 3" size. I sure hope they all get to be that 7-8" size but from the vibe i get is we in the u.s. have a harder time getting fish to be that size for some reason??

[strawberryblonde]

I think you can do it without too much trouble, if my first experiences are any indicator. Oh and yep, I'm here in the US and even stuck in an area with HIGH pH.

I just did 2 water changes per day for the first 2 months, then 1 80 - 90% WC every day for the next 6 months. If it looked like the tank needed it, I'd do an extra WC and scrub all the sides, bottom, clean filters etc that day during the 6 months.

For food I gave mine flakes for breakfast, put freeze dried blackworms in upside down Lee's cones so they could free feed and gave them a beefheart cube every time I passed by the tank. It was abou 6-7 feedings per day. I just was careful not to feed beefheart after the evening water change.

When they reached 5" I put them into a larger tank (went from a 54g to a 115g) and that was that. A year later they were all huge.

I'm repeating it with a new batch of Golden Sunshines from John's Discus as we speak. They've been in my 55g tank for 12 days and have all grown between 1/4" and 1/2" so far. Ohhhh, they were exactly 4" when I got them. =)

[CrazyAngels]

Cameron, that is one sweet discus, leave me the keys to your house I'll come by and visit. LOL


Here ya go, not the best picture. Took it 5 mins ago.
http://i.imgur.com/UKsVw.jpg?1

[spiffyfish]

I saw your old thread on your fish Toni, they all look really nice. So i guess my ruitine wont cutit for these guys then huh? I also need to try just a basic Bh recipe maybe one i saw Skip mention cause they didnt like the first one i made even after starving them so i stopped trying. Altough instead of actual bh i used ground beef. Oh and Cameron your fish is really nice any other pics.

[strawberryblonde]

Thanks Spiffy, I was trying hard not to hijack your thread with my questions and wanted to encourage you with my experiences with my discus. Hopefully I didn't scare you off?

I think if you can manage twice a day water changes just for 2 months it will make a huge difference. And yeah, there are days when you just can't manage a WC, and that's ok so long as it doesn't happen often. On days when I knew I wouldn't be home to change water I made sure to ONLY give them a healthy feeding of flakes in the morning and then I'd put half a dozen of Al's FDBW cubes in the lees cone. No beefheart if you can't do those water changes!

So about the beefheart. I know it's very common to feed beefheart, and I did it with my first group right from the start, but I can tell you from this latest batch I'm raising that it isn't the end all of good growth.

I only just started mine on beefheart today, they've been in my tank for 12 days and they've already had some nice measurable growth just eating Prime Reef flakes and Al's FDBW cubes. They eat a LOT of them too! They get alternating feedings of flakes and cubes all day. I try for 6-7 feedings. For five 4" discus it's a tsp. of flakes at each feeding and 2 blackworm cubes per feeding.

Have you tried San Fransisco Bay Brand Beefheart cubes? I'm too lazy to prepare my own and they all love the SF brand. I buy it 12 pkg's at a time from Drs Foster and Smith. They ship it Next Day Air for $24 no matter how much you order. Oh and you get a nice styro cooler that comes in handy for other things. I've used them for everything from picnics to salt dips for one of my fish last week when she was gravely ill. LOL

[magewynd]

Great stuff Toni. Thanks for sharing.

Spiffy good luck growing them out. You've got some great stock to start with.

[stac545]

Spiffyfish ~
Can we see pics of your new fish?


Stacy

[spiffyfish]

Thanks for the info Toni, i have been feeding my other discus fdbw so these ones will get them as well. I have tried the sfbh but my other discus didnt really go for it. It also doesnt have as much protein as if i were to make it my self. I may just try fdbw and colorbits with these guys. Bh is messy to make and clean up after. As far as pictures i will try and get some up tonight, they dont have much color yet as they are still small so dont get too excited.. Thanks steve i hope they come out good.

[spiffyfish]

Also dont mind about taking over my thread Toni im not one to get mad about that. I am here to learn and look at other peoples setups as are most of everyone on here. So be my guest whenever you feel to put something in my thread it wont only help me but everyone else too.

[Harry Marsh]

Pictures!


Regarding piwow's
Similar to any other discus, although they tend to 'color up' much later than others
3" or so and you'll start to get color, when other strains are already far along
It will be 5" or so before you get a full pattern. They look brown/dull for much longer than other strains (but, worth the wait)