Is a 180 litre tank large enough for four Discus fish?

[karlonming]

I bought 4 Discus fish two days ago, any time i go near the tank they panic speed of and hide. How long will it take for them to calm down?. Also is my 180 litre tank large enough for them?. And how often should i do water changes?, i have 4 neon and 5 cardinal tetras in the tank and normally do a 20% weekly change. Any advice would be appreciated. 75621

[discuspaul]

Give them some time to settle in, de-stress, and get comfortable in their new environment. That can take a week or two, sometimes longer. And they may not eat, or eat very little, for a few days.

Your 180 litre tank may be somewhat tight as the discus grow - what size are they now ?

Keep in mind that 4 discus is not a generally good number to keep for social compatability reasons - 5 would be better - but see how it goes first before doing anything further.

Hope your temp is up to 82 or higher - the neons will not likely do well at that temp, though.

Depending on the size of the discus you should up your wcs - daily for small fish, e.g. 2" -3", to at least 2X or 3X a week for fish of 4" or larger - and the wcs should be more than 20% - suggest at least 40% -50% or more.

Good luck to you.

[karlonming]

Give them some time to settle in, de-stress, and get comfortable in their new environment. That can take a week or two, sometimes longer. And they may not eat, or eat very little, for a few days.

Your 180 litre tank may be somewhat tight as the discus grow - what size are they now ?

Keep in mind that 4 discus is not a generally good number to keep for social compatability reasons - 5 would be better - but see how it goes first before doing anything further.

Hope your temp is up to 82 or higher - the neons will not likely do well at that temp, though.

Depending on the size of the discus you should up your wcs - daily for small fish, e.g. 2" -3", to at least 2X or 3X a week for fish of 4" or larger - and the wcs should be more than 20% - suggest at least 40% -50% or more.

Good luck to you.

Thanks for your reply. They are about 2inchs, is it because they are young that they need wcs every day wouldn't that stress them out more if i do so?. I can barely go near the tank to feed the other fish. starting to regret buying them. Do you think a pet store would take them of me?.

[discuspaul]

Yes, 2" are quite small/young, and do present a challenge to grow them out properly & healthily, hence the need for daily wcs for young fish of that size. Very clean tank conditions and fresh new water daily will facilitate the proper development of their immune systems, and create the environment for them to grow well in. They will also need several feedings daily until they get to over 3" or more.
They would soon get used to your tank, and to daily wcs, the latter which is the only way to avoid producing stunted fish.

Since you have other tankmates with them, I'm assuming your tank may also be planted and have other decor - not a good environment to grow out discus that young in a healthy way.

Where did you get them ? Would your source not take them back, perhaps exchanging them for larger specimens preferably larger than 3" (which would cost you some extra $$).

A LFS which is not your source of these fish may or may not be prepared to take them. They would likely, if you offered them for free - otherwise, they would not give you very much for them.

[camuth8]

I think that the tank size is great, but you may have to move them into a bigger tank when they're about 4-5 inches. You should also be doing frequent water changes and big ones,too. I do 60% about 5 times a week. If you have the time, you might be able to do it even more, as Paul said.

[karlonming]

Thanks Paul and camuth8 for your Replies, I got the fish from a breeder 4 for 30 pound in Londonderry northern Ireland. The impression i got from him, i doubt that he would take them back. I was thinking of giving them away for free to a pet store, or anyone who wanted them, but i think i will put the effort in and try my best to rear them right. I will invest in a larger tank soon and maybe add another one. Thanks again for your advice.

[discuspaul]

Great to hear you're going to give it a go - that's wonderful. I admire you for that.
Give them as large and as frequent wcs as you can, try to feed them at least 3 or 4 times a day, keep your tank as clean and detritus-free as you can, and I believe you will be surprised at the positive results, assuming the discus were healthy and of good quality to begin with.

You might consider removing some of the rocks and other decor to permit you to do the best tank cleansing job that you can, maintain a temp around the 84F mark (29C), check your water params fairly frequently, and don't concern yourself with how the Neons & Cardinals are doing - you may lose some, particularly the neons, but keep your focus on the discus.
In a month or two they should reach over 3" in size, and you can then begin to relax just a little - you'll be on your way.
They can readily remain in that tank until they reach around 4" - then you'll be well-advised to give them larger quarters.
At that point, you could reduce your feeding & wc regimen somewhat.
All the best to you.

[shoveltrash]

you will probably have the best luck with Discus that size if you remove all that gravel substrate (bits of food & debris hide in gravel & decompose, fouling water). if you read up here on this forum, it is typically recommended to use a bare bottom tank for raising juvenile Discus.
your tank translates to 48 gallons (I think), which is fine for 4 Discus. but as has been said, a larger group would feel more secure & will feed better.
it is easier to start off with Discus that are larger - I started with a group of six @ 3.5-4" in size.
as for WCs, imho they'll get used to that. mine now LOVE when I WC - at first I fed frozen bloodworms just after a WC (a treat).
good luck & welcome to SD! there's TONS of great info here - answers to just about any questions you could ask :D.

[strawberryblonde]

Hi and welcome to the Simply Discus forums! =)

I think you can successfully raise your discus and once they are larger you'll be thrilled to own them. (trust me on this, I brag about mine all the time and love to show them off)

The hiding and fleeing behavior is totally normal when you first put discus in your home tank. It takes them awhile to adjust to the new surroundings and for a lot of them, this is the first time they haven't had a big bunch of other baby discus swimming with them, so they get skittish.

Your tank is beautiful! I know you are going to hate some of my advice, because it's going to mean altering all that gorgeous work you've put into the decor, but if you just grit your teeth and do it, the discus will grow quickly and in a few months you'll be able to decorate again.

So here's what I'd do to ensure the best possible health and growth of your new babies.

1) Take out all the rocks, 3/4 of the gravel (only leave one little layer of gravel, just to cover the glass on the bottom so they don't see their reflections) and remove most of the plants. It looks like they might be plastic, so the ones you keep can be situated easily on one side of the tank, and then you feed the discus on the opposite side so the plants don't get food in them.

2) Turn your heater 90 degrees so that it's parallel to the bottom. If it's upright, discus will try to lay eggs on it and can get some nasty burns. Oh and also move it down in the tank, just below the water level when you do a water change. I put mine about 3 inches from the bottom of the tank. That way I don't have to unplug it, and there's no danger of draining too much water out and cracking a hot heater.

3) Make sure your water temp is 28-30 degrees.

4) If you work outside your home, plan to buy an inexpensive auto feeder so that they can have a couple of meals of discus flakes during the day.

5) Make sure that you don't have too much current from your filter. Discus can handle water movement, but if the current is too swift they'll hide on the opposite corner and get exhausted when they have to "swim against the tide". LOL

Ok, now that you've got everything optimized for your new babies, it's time to get down to the basics that juvie discus need.

1) Foods - Discus need quality foods that are high in protein. You can purchase frozen beefheart cubes fairly inexpensively as well as discus flakes, discus pellets and freeze dried blackworms or bloodworms.
They should get a variety of foods each day, and the mid day auto feeder meals can be the flakes. Try to feed beefheart at night, 30 minutes before water changes because leftover bits will foul the water. Blackworms are fine anytime and they love them for breakfast! Aim for 5 feedings per day and adjust amounts as you figure out how much they can eat at each feeding (they graze slowly so you can't hurry them - plan on 30 minutes for each meal)

2) Water Changes - Juvies need plenty of fresh water. Aim for a daily water change of 60% - 80%. If you know that you're not going to be able to do a water change, don't feed beefheart that day. So long as you don't skip more than a day here and there you'll be just fine. Oh and for water changes, if you don't already own a python syphon, buy one...much much easier than using buckets!

3) For water quality, you'll want to check your ammonia, nitrites and nitrates every day until you get a handle on how your system and your water changes are going. If you find any ammonia or nitrites, do water changes till you drop those numbers. They should be zero if your tank is fully cycled. Nitrates will always be present in the tank, but aim to keep them below 10ppm. Discus are very sensitive to nitrates.

Hmmm, I think that's it for now. Oh wait, one more thing. Be sure to rinse your filter media in tank water (in a bucket) once a week during a water change. Don't squeeze or abuse the media, just a good rinse to get any bits of crud off of it.

And there ya go. A few things to optimize the tank and just 3 rules for growing them out. They really are easy fish to keep, just a bit more work when they are young than most freshwater fish...and totally worth the work!