Duckesd
09-26-2012, 10:00 PM
DISEASE QUESTIONNAIRE
Problem
1. Please explain the problems with your fish/when and how they started
Current problem is that all discus are grouped extremely tightly in the corners of the tank, darker strains of fish are heading towards black and some fish are floating sideways/upside down. This is what's happened...
After losing multiple batches of try to sickness even though their tanks/water were in top condition, it was recommended to us that we need to 'clean up' the breeding pairs first. We have roughly 300 discus in total, so this was looing like a very big job. We decided that since no one had any particular health issues, it would be easiest to treat all of the breeders together in our large 6 foot tank - don't have exact numbers as I'm at work but there's roughly 25 large adult discus in the tank.
We started with a course of PP treatments, and the fish looked great afterwards. We decided they needed a bit of a break after that before de-worming started, so left them for about a week. We then discovered that a pair we had in another tank by themselves which had been in quarantine since they'd been sick since arrival, had actually come from the same tanks (from the supplier) as a pair we now have in the 6 footer with all our other fish!!! We've been treating the other pair with metro as all symptoms pointed to hex and it was recommended to us. Here and there we started to see some mucousy white poo's in the 6 foot tank, so knowing that all of these fish had now been exposed to the same disease, we thought it would be best to treat sooner rather than later, and began treating them with metro which is where the trouble started. As has been recommended, I upped the temp to about 30 celsius, and dosed them with 400mg per 40 litres of metro (we were told you can dose up to 500mg), every 24 hours for a total of 2 treatments (50% water changes in between). On that second day a couple of the fish weren't looking too good - they were tilting sideways and a few were huddled up in the corners. We decided to stop the metro straight away as it was looking bad and I was worried that something else could be going on. By the following day, all of the fish were tightly huddled in the corners, and some were going black and titling completely sideways or upside down, and some of their slime coats look cloudy.
After talking to a few people we know in the discus world they said it sounded like a bacterial infection, and that we should treat with salt and possibly an antibiotic. Bacterial kinda made sense as I'd turned the heat up for the metro, so if there was any bacteria that would have given them an excellent chance to proliferate. The most broad antibiotic I had on hand was oxytetracycline so in that went - I know now it may have been a bad idea but seeing that many fish in that state just made me want to act. We dosed with rock salt at 1 tsp per 10 litres, and also the oxytetracycline (dont have dosage rate on me as I'm at work but will fill in later). The oxy has gone in twice now, 24 hrs apart for the last two days - we have not done anything so far today and the fish look terrible. After keeping discus for roughly 2 years with no serious health issues this is really freaking me out.
2. Symptoms (i.e. turning dark, excess slime, not eating, clamped fins, flashing, darting, clamped gills, white/yellow/green poop, hiding, headstanding or tailstanding, white on tips of fins, rotting or fungus, blisters/ white zits on fish, bloated, cloudy eyes, wounds)
As above - huddling tightly together, floating sideways, clamped fins, going dark - generally look like their on deaths door.
3. What medications/ treatments that you have already tried and results. Include dosages and duration of treatment.
Medications started with PP at 2ppm every 3rd day for 3 treatments - fish looked great at this stage.
Next was metro at 400mg per 40 litres, for a total of two treatments, 24 hours apart with 50% water changes in between - it was after the second treatment the fish started to look really bad and we stopped immediately and did a large w/c.
Next was oxytetracycline (started 24-48hrs after finished metro - don't have my log book in front of me as I'm at work but can confirm tonight) I think it might be 1 gram per 100 litres but will have to check at home. We've added this the last two days along with salt at 1 tsp per 10 litres, and did a 50% water change between each dose.
Tank/Water
4. Tank size and age, number and size of fish
Tank size is 6x2x2 foot, it's been running for approx. 6 months since fully cycled, but we recently had to take the cannister filter off, so have been running sponge filters during treatment with large water changes to keep parameters safe. For treatment (not usual stocking levels) it's got roughly 25 large adult discus (again, will have to confirm exact numbers tonight).
5. Water change regime/ how long has tank been running/ bare bottom or gravel/ do you age your water?
We've been changing 50 - 70% of the water daily, using water that has been aged, aerated and heated overnight. Barebottom tank.
6 Parameters and water source;
- temp _____ 28 degrees celsius currently (was up at 30ish when we did metro)
- ph _____ 7.5
- ammonia reading ____ 0
- nitrite reading ____ 0
- nitrate reading ____ 0
- well water ____ no
- municipal water ____ yes
I know the zero levels seem a bit unbeleivable, but I re-tested and they are all zero so our water change regime is obviously keeping up.
7. Any new fish/plants added recently
No brand new fish, one fish was added into this tank roughly 3 weeks ago for the treatment period - however he's only new to this tank. We've had him in a separate tank with his mate for roughly 3 months and he's been fine.
I know that was a huge amount to read through, but would appreciate any and all advice. First thing I need to know is if we should keep up the antibiotics this afternoon or stop treatment completely? We spend our entire lives taking care of our fish so it would be devastating to lose any - I just want to save them and get them back to their usual happy selves.
Problem
1. Please explain the problems with your fish/when and how they started
Current problem is that all discus are grouped extremely tightly in the corners of the tank, darker strains of fish are heading towards black and some fish are floating sideways/upside down. This is what's happened...
After losing multiple batches of try to sickness even though their tanks/water were in top condition, it was recommended to us that we need to 'clean up' the breeding pairs first. We have roughly 300 discus in total, so this was looing like a very big job. We decided that since no one had any particular health issues, it would be easiest to treat all of the breeders together in our large 6 foot tank - don't have exact numbers as I'm at work but there's roughly 25 large adult discus in the tank.
We started with a course of PP treatments, and the fish looked great afterwards. We decided they needed a bit of a break after that before de-worming started, so left them for about a week. We then discovered that a pair we had in another tank by themselves which had been in quarantine since they'd been sick since arrival, had actually come from the same tanks (from the supplier) as a pair we now have in the 6 footer with all our other fish!!! We've been treating the other pair with metro as all symptoms pointed to hex and it was recommended to us. Here and there we started to see some mucousy white poo's in the 6 foot tank, so knowing that all of these fish had now been exposed to the same disease, we thought it would be best to treat sooner rather than later, and began treating them with metro which is where the trouble started. As has been recommended, I upped the temp to about 30 celsius, and dosed them with 400mg per 40 litres of metro (we were told you can dose up to 500mg), every 24 hours for a total of 2 treatments (50% water changes in between). On that second day a couple of the fish weren't looking too good - they were tilting sideways and a few were huddled up in the corners. We decided to stop the metro straight away as it was looking bad and I was worried that something else could be going on. By the following day, all of the fish were tightly huddled in the corners, and some were going black and titling completely sideways or upside down, and some of their slime coats look cloudy.
After talking to a few people we know in the discus world they said it sounded like a bacterial infection, and that we should treat with salt and possibly an antibiotic. Bacterial kinda made sense as I'd turned the heat up for the metro, so if there was any bacteria that would have given them an excellent chance to proliferate. The most broad antibiotic I had on hand was oxytetracycline so in that went - I know now it may have been a bad idea but seeing that many fish in that state just made me want to act. We dosed with rock salt at 1 tsp per 10 litres, and also the oxytetracycline (dont have dosage rate on me as I'm at work but will fill in later). The oxy has gone in twice now, 24 hrs apart for the last two days - we have not done anything so far today and the fish look terrible. After keeping discus for roughly 2 years with no serious health issues this is really freaking me out.
2. Symptoms (i.e. turning dark, excess slime, not eating, clamped fins, flashing, darting, clamped gills, white/yellow/green poop, hiding, headstanding or tailstanding, white on tips of fins, rotting or fungus, blisters/ white zits on fish, bloated, cloudy eyes, wounds)
As above - huddling tightly together, floating sideways, clamped fins, going dark - generally look like their on deaths door.
3. What medications/ treatments that you have already tried and results. Include dosages and duration of treatment.
Medications started with PP at 2ppm every 3rd day for 3 treatments - fish looked great at this stage.
Next was metro at 400mg per 40 litres, for a total of two treatments, 24 hours apart with 50% water changes in between - it was after the second treatment the fish started to look really bad and we stopped immediately and did a large w/c.
Next was oxytetracycline (started 24-48hrs after finished metro - don't have my log book in front of me as I'm at work but can confirm tonight) I think it might be 1 gram per 100 litres but will have to check at home. We've added this the last two days along with salt at 1 tsp per 10 litres, and did a 50% water change between each dose.
Tank/Water
4. Tank size and age, number and size of fish
Tank size is 6x2x2 foot, it's been running for approx. 6 months since fully cycled, but we recently had to take the cannister filter off, so have been running sponge filters during treatment with large water changes to keep parameters safe. For treatment (not usual stocking levels) it's got roughly 25 large adult discus (again, will have to confirm exact numbers tonight).
5. Water change regime/ how long has tank been running/ bare bottom or gravel/ do you age your water?
We've been changing 50 - 70% of the water daily, using water that has been aged, aerated and heated overnight. Barebottom tank.
6 Parameters and water source;
- temp _____ 28 degrees celsius currently (was up at 30ish when we did metro)
- ph _____ 7.5
- ammonia reading ____ 0
- nitrite reading ____ 0
- nitrate reading ____ 0
- well water ____ no
- municipal water ____ yes
I know the zero levels seem a bit unbeleivable, but I re-tested and they are all zero so our water change regime is obviously keeping up.
7. Any new fish/plants added recently
No brand new fish, one fish was added into this tank roughly 3 weeks ago for the treatment period - however he's only new to this tank. We've had him in a separate tank with his mate for roughly 3 months and he's been fine.
I know that was a huge amount to read through, but would appreciate any and all advice. First thing I need to know is if we should keep up the antibiotics this afternoon or stop treatment completely? We spend our entire lives taking care of our fish so it would be devastating to lose any - I just want to save them and get them back to their usual happy selves.